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| Marijuana Legalization | |
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| Topic Started: May 2 2008, 06:39 AM (150 Views) | |
| Naoko | May 2 2008, 06:39 AM Post #1 |
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http://www.washingtonwatch.com/bills/show/110_HR_5843.html ^ Current bill that would allow adults to use and own a small amount (100g) of marijuana. Also, apparently co-sponsored by Ron Paul. Your thoughts? Personally, I don't think any type of legalization of marijuana is a good idea, except perhaps medicinal marijuana under a watchful eye. |
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| LollyWolly | May 2 2008, 10:50 AM Post #2 |
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Cranky
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from a former druggie... its not worth all the problems that it would cause... people going to work high.. people driving while high.. and the list goes on. |
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| Mr. Storm | May 2 2008, 03:40 PM Post #3 |
Child of Dust
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Legalize all drugs, increase the penalty for DUI/DWI. I've said that for awhile. |
 "I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason and intellect has intended us to forego their use." - Galileo Galilei | |
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| Naoko | May 2 2008, 08:53 PM Post #4 |
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Wow. I really wasn't expecting that. I'd rather keep most drugs illegal, and also increase the penalty for DUI. Kthxbai. While I can understand that some people may prefer having the freedom to use certain drugs, as well as the fact that marijuana isn't a particularly harmful drug, I don't think legalization is a good idea at all. Obviously, legalizing things like cocaine and heroine... Bad idea. Seriously bad idea. I could understand MJ to an extent, but these are just crazy, for very obvious reasons. MJ, on the other hand, tends to lead into other drugs, like those drugs. Also bad. Lolly could vouch for me on this, I think. Alcohol and cigarettes already pose a huge problem in our society. Alcohol is different from other drugs, as it's one of the very very few that can be done in moderation without much negative consequence (and can even possibly have a positive consequence in moderation). Even so, it's caused a hell of a lot of problems. Legalizing drugs will only make them much more wide-spread. Once they're legalized, it's not likely to be possible to make them illegal again, unless you want another prohibition-type period. Not likely to be good. If they're more wide-spread, addiction will obviously become a lot more wide-spread. And getting addicted to these things is nothing like getting addicted to cigarettes. You try to get off cigarettes, you get irritable and want to eat constantly. You try to get off crack, you pretty much go crazy in a lot of ways. I don't recommend it. So basically, with the legalization of uber drugs like cocaine, what do we get? A lot more deaths caused by traffic accidents and overdoses, filled-up psych wards/rehab facilities/etc, and plenty of other problems. And honestly? I think legalizing a lot of these drugs would hurt our economy. |
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| LollyWolly | May 2 2008, 09:40 PM Post #5 |
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Cranky
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QFT Yup I could vouch for you on that. Alcohol was one thing... but marijuana led to opiates which led to benzos which led to barbiturates which led to cocaine which led to dissociatives... and it goes on and on. I've heard of the idea of legalizing drugs as a way to boost the economy with something else to tax, but the harder they are to access the better. It's not worth tempting people who are addicted or causing more people to become addicted to any type of chemical. I can just see the signs now: "We Card: Not 18? No Heroin." |
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| burnedalive | May 3 2008, 12:14 AM Post #6 |
RAWR!!!!!!! GRAH!!!!
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There is also the possibility of leading some people away from marijuana. Those "rebellious" people might not want to o it anymore. Though, that's all theory :P |
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| Mr. Storm | May 3 2008, 02:38 AM Post #7 |
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Child of Dust
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Employers can fire employees if they don't like the drugs they're taking. As for driving, I'll get to that in a bit.
The whole theory behind marijuana being a "gateway drug" is purely environmental and psychological. Trying marijuana does not biologically make you want to try other drugs. It might put you in a druggie environment or make you think you want to try more, but that's purely based on the person and can be controlled.
Cigarettes aren't a problem at all. Alcohol is only a problem because DUI is such a light offense. DUI's current penalties should be dropped for something along the penalty lines of attempted murder, while a death caused by drunk driving should be murder. If you get behind the wheel while under the influence, you're basically saying you don't care if other people get hurt. Once people get thrown in jail for 20 years for driving under the influence of drugs/booze, and risk the death penalty/life without parole if they get in an accident, the effect of deterrence kicks in.
Are you aware of the War on Drugs? We live in a prohibition-type period. People are dying to smuggle the crap over the border. Drug cartels are scary powerful because of the multi-billion dollar industry they're in charge of. And even if we take down a network, another one just pops right back up and takes it place. All we're doing right now is wasting law enforcement officers lives, and some druggies lives too cause of the dangers of a unregulated drug industry.
So? It's like you're saying it's the government's business to go into people's lives and say how they can treat their body. It's not. If they wanna try drugs, they risk getting addicted. It sucks for them, but it's the consequence to their choices. The key word there is choice. We live in a free country. We rise and fall by our own choices and decisions. That's the foundation of our country.
Lives filled with liberty and the pursuit of happiness, however they see fit. |
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"I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason and intellect has intended us to forego their use." - Galileo Galilei | |
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| LollyWolly | May 3 2008, 04:55 AM Post #8 |
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Cranky
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Maybe it hasn't been "scientifically" proven to lead to other drugs but try talking to anyone who has gone through a long-term period of chemical dependency and maybe you'll change your mind. Have you ever been to an NA meeting before? If you haven't, then listen to those people. By the way I'm not some paranoid crack attack case thats always drunk and loaded. I know nobody said I was but I'm just pointing that out. I graduated from the second largest high school in NJ with honors and went to Rutgers University. So I am somewhat smart. Not everyone that thinks weed is a gateway drug is a dope fiend living in an inner city shooting gallery. There are plenty of successful people that have had drug problems. |
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| Naoko | May 3 2008, 07:37 AM Post #9 |
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Controlled, perhaps, but that doesn't change the fact that it is still what you'd call a "gateway drug," considering how much that does happen.
Okay, so all the lung cancer and breathing problems aren't a problem. The fact that some of the unhealthiest cities in America became such due to the high amount of second hand smoke isn't a problem. We needs dictionary ohnoz.
I don't know about it being considered murder, although I agree to an extent. If someone killed someone I cared about because they were stupid and idiotic enough to get behind the wheel after being stupid enough to get drunk, I'd want them locked up. Drunk driving is one of the worst offenses in this country that gets off far too easily - it's like leaving babies in cars.
Legalizing drugs won't make the first part of this any better. As for cops and druggies? We're often going about things the wrong way. Locking someone up for being addicted really isn't the way to go. These people need help more than anything else (in most cases, at least).
First off, I don't get how "if they become wide-spread etc." = "oh my god government should control everyone's lives lols." Last time I checked, we still have law in this country, and there are certain things you can and cannot do. There's no such thing as a perfectly free country, and on top of that, I think it's obvious that Europe and Canada are kind of beating us at this whole free thing in so many ways lately. And really, let's not forget psychiatry. They tell people not to cut, they tell people not to be anorexic, and if you do those things and get caught, YOU GON GET LOCKED UP with a fancy jacket. Same thing goes with drugs. I wouldn't consider that to really be freedom either, but hey, what can you do? Back to topic. No, it's not the government's business what you want to do with your body. Want to buy illegal drugs and use them? Sure, go ahead, you can. Government can't do anything about that, but they're going to go after the dude that sold it to you, and when you get addicted, they might (hopefully) send you to rehab. Whoo! I think you do have a point with the "government shouldn't control our bodies" thing, but there are a lot of crappy things revolving around this topic. I was going to say more, but seeing as how I got sidetracked and stopped typing anything on this post nearly an hour ago, I've lost my train of thought. So uh, bye, lols. I has slight ADD. |
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| Mr. Storm | May 3 2008, 08:12 AM Post #10 |
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Child of Dust
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Do you still think it'd be a "gateway drug" if it was legal?
People can have lung cancer and emphysema as much as they want, it's their body. As for secondhand smoke...I suggest you do some research. While it obviously isn't as healthy as breathing pure air, its negative effects are extremely overexaggerated. Almost all the statistics getting tossed about come from one study that was thrown out by a Federal court for being garbage. There's hardly extensive research on the issue.
Even though you disagree slightly, I'm glad to hear it. My mother was almost killed by a drunk driver and I don't have the warmest place in my heart reserved for them.
Legalizing drugs will kill the black market and seriously wound the cartels. Not to mention all the lives saved. Cops usually get in trouble when they raid the dealers or labs or something. Where the cartels have their money, in effect. I agree with your conclusion about most druggies.
That was in reference to addiction, which is a logical possible result of recreational use in drugs. Addiction does not give the government the right to charge into our lives.
Yes, these things are (generally) things that harm others in some way. Rape isn't okay. Me choosing to get high is my own decision and doesn't hurt anyone else unless I get behind the wheel of a vehicle.
Hahahaha...you're joking, right? Unless you mean like "free healthcare" or something. Because last time I checked, Europe has all kinds of freedom-encroaching laws.
I don't think you should get locked up unless you want to harm others somehow. Unless, of course, you want help dropping a habit and some kind of radical rehab is the only way... Anyway.
Why should they go after the guy that sold it to me? It's my money, my body, his drugs, so... what's wrong here? Sounds like a perfectly legal transaction to me. Unfortunately, it isn't for reasons beyond my knowledge. I'm just bugged by this whole issue. We do own our bodies. We can tattoo them, we can get them fat, we can get them skinny. We can have plastic surgery, we can pull crazy death defying stunts, we can make porn with our bodies. We can smoke cigars, drink till we drop dead, and have abortions. Yet, the moment we grab that joint, we've crossed some line. What line did we cross? |
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"I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason and intellect has intended us to forego their use." - Galileo Galilei | |
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| Naoko | May 5 2008, 12:45 AM Post #11 |
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Alcohol is legal, and yet it still does the same thing, although maybe not to the same degree. I've met plenty of people who got turned onto other drugs from alcohol. It's a bit different, but it still happens. This isn't going to change if anything is legalized.
It's their body, but that doesn't change the fact that it's still a big problem. I'm not saying to make them stop. There are other ways of combating that - like ads and awareness. Unfortunately, some people are just really stupid. Whether the effects of secondhand smoke are exaggerated or not, they're still there. No matter what study you read, it's still hurting people. If a study says there's no effects at all, then I doubt it was a reliable study. Remember, just because there was a study doesn't mean it was done reliably - this applies to both sides of the matter. And in the end, whether you think it hurts people or not, if you go to the doctor, he's going to tell you to not smoke around your kids. Even if it isn't "OH MY GOD SECONDHAND SMOKE IS GOING TO KILL ME," it still hurts people.
It's not that I disagree, it's that no matter how you read it, the Bill of Rights would find the death penalty to be "cruel and unusual punishment" for someone who killed another from drunk driving. Even if the death penalty was in effect, there's no way we'd ever put a stupid drunk driver on death row with people who intentionally killed someone. Still, I would like drunk drivers (especially those who killed people) to get a tougher sentence than they usually do.
Lives saved in some areas, lost in others. But anyway. Legalizing drugs isn't going to kill the black market for drugs. It will just warp it. It's going to change and find a different way to peddle drugs - develop stronger drugs if they possibly can, etc. Although I see your point, and in essence you're correct, it's not going to kill the black market for drugs.
Good for you, but I didn't say that.
We have a lot of laws in place to protect people from their own stupidity. Curfews for minors, for example. Or age-limitations on drugs. Regardless of where our country heads, we'll going to continue having laws like this. A purely libertarian society isn't going to happen in America any time soon.
Depends on where you go. Some laws are "Freer," and some are "less free," I suppose you could say. On top of this, our capitalist economy is so messed up - the rich get richer and the poor get poorer, as they always say. Since in many of these other countries, people are closer in means of income, it becomes a "freer" country. Those with less money aren't tied down as much as they are here. Freedom goes outside of laws themselves. |
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| Hellonearth | May 19 2008, 05:47 PM Post #12 |
Chu Chu
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Here is the point of the legalization. TOTAL BULL! Some people need it for curing aliments and the government sees it as a way to get high. The government only sees the negative of how it is used and not the positive. They think people will abuse it for there own means. SO WHAT! Let the bastards use it and get sever brain damage. After some time the SOB is going down and taking his pot head ways with him. |
| Im back people. Deal with it!!! | |
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