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A Seasoned Player's Thoughts; My opinions on the new releases
Topic Started: 17th July 2015 - 09:19 PM (848 Views)
Helios
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Stormvermin
Wow, I've been away for a long while (hatching all sorts of vile schemes naturally). Still working hard getting my Skaven/tomb-king mash-up wrapped up, and I"ll continue to despite the new changes. Which leads to the reason I'm posting this thread!

On one hand I'm really interested in where this will go. The warscroll format leads to a very real setup for limited edition units like we had heard rumors about. In that regard I wonder/hope that GW is looking to try and add a new level of versatility within units that may eve exceed 40K. I suspect that the ultimate plan is to try and get customers away from the currently available units as rules expand. Very interesting to see an almost nonexistent set of core rules. That also supports my thought that we'll see greater complexity aimed at specific units as they're released with their warscrolls. In that regard, I'm going to hold my breath and cross my fingers that some of what I dislike, a lot, will be taken care of in time.
Also, despite some of the critiques I've seen, I really do like the look of the new models. I think we can expect some pretty cool things in the future.


What I Dislike: Again, I suspect a lot of this will evolve as new models are released, because it feels so open ended, but at this moment these points suck in terms of what I enjoyed about the game.

-Nerfed magic. Super disppointed to see that magic looks like it's pretty much been gutted. Lame. This point is the one I am most unhappy about.
-No more magic items: Being able to build a character was a valuable asset in the strategy element of the game, and simply a lot of fun.
-Nerfed strength and toughness. I sitll need to spend the time in a thorough read, but as of now it looks like hits and wounds are all pretty standard across the board and the only variable make a character or piece harder to kill is the number of wounds it has? My big problem with this change is that it totally nullifies the tactical choices I previously used in taking any given unit up against any other. Again, maybe I need to see this in practice, but based on what I'm seeing, wounds are no longer being measured against any stat, you don't appear to have to consider much what you're throwing against what. IE, a single skaven slave potentially has a chance to wound an enemy general. Yes, the enemy general has more wounds but this chance really seems to me like it transforms what was previously tactical into nothing more than a dice game. Yes, the game always relied on odds, but this seems far more up to chance.

I haven't had a chance to play under the new rules yet, but my gut sense is that the strategy element is going to be pretty minimal... or overly simple. There doesn't appear to be the same environment that allowed for complex tactics. While I think on one hand the streamlining offers some great things it looks to me like it's going to create a far more one-dimensional experience of the game, at least until more units are released.

So that's my gripe, generally summed up with the feeling that this is really minimalistic and a bit of a let down. I have high hopes it will play out in a fun way, but so far I'm not overly impressed with the rules.


*I thought the previous edition immediately before they did Endtimes was the best version of the game I've seen.

Edited by Helios, 17th July 2015 - 09:20 PM.
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s'nkeep
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Ajax = warpstone juice

Tombking skaven.. Were you one of the rats of ruin?
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Helios
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Stormvermin
s'nkeep
18th July 2015 - 06:55 PM
Tombking skaven.. Were you one of the rats of ruin?
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No, I'm doing a themed army, you can find it under Clan S'et in the army diaries if you want to see. Basically the idea was an off-shoot clan that wound up in Kehmri. So I've been using weapons and armor/trophies from the tomb kings and intermixing them with the skaven. I was really stoked about the end times since you could use necro magic with any army and that wound up kind of fitting what I was doing. Here's the Lord (P'tah the Skullcrusher). This was taken before I had finished:
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Oh side note: Also peeved at how nerfed Deathmaster Snkitch is now.
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TrueLancer
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You think he's nerfed? Able to singlehandedly do 15 wounds, untargetable except from close range, a true character killer, and able to reveal himself and place himself in a location where it's impossible for many attacks to be put onto him... he seems pretty neat.

Much better than a 4+ chance to not get murdered in the open for hundreds of free hero points, that's for sure.
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Helios
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Stormvermin
TrueLancer
21st July 2015 - 12:17 AM
You think he's nerfed? Able to singlehandedly do 15 wounds, untargetable except from close range, a true character killer, and able to reveal himself and place himself in a location where it's impossible for many attacks to be put onto him... he seems pretty neat.

Much better than a 4+ chance to not get murdered in the open for hundreds of free hero points, that's for sure.
Ok fine.. I was just being stubborn and set in "the old ways.". I saw later he still basically gets the weeping blades as the D3 damage too. Yeah, objectively he may even be improved.
Edited by Helios, 21st July 2015 - 01:17 AM.
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Sleboda
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Hell, I'm just putting TK + Skaven (and some Lizards) all on the table together.

Sorted!

Gotta get some stormfiends, and finish my abomination and stegadon to go with my sphinxes, krox, and ushabti.
True scholars have more than just one book to study.
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Helios
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Sleboda
22nd July 2015 - 01:48 AM
Hell, I'm just putting TK + Skaven (and some Lizards) all on the table together.

Sorted!

Gotta get some stormfiends, and finish my abomination and stegadon to go with my sphinxes, krox, and ushabti.
Haha I was just thinking: In the new game what's to stop us from having "armies" made up of anything we want?
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izmerul
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Helios
22nd July 2015 - 04:45 AM
Haha I was just thinking: In the new game what's to stop us from having "armies" made up of anything we want?
Well for starters I would hope common sense. And then respect for your oponent and the 30 years of background that just got destroyed?
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Helios
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Stormvermin
izmerul
22nd July 2015 - 10:01 AM
Helios
22nd July 2015 - 04:45 AM
Haha I was just thinking: In the new game what's to stop us from having "armies" made up of anything we want?
Well for starters I would hope common sense. And then respect for your oponent and the 30 years of background that just got destroyed?
The point is that's how loose the rules appear to be currently. So far I have yet to see anything that says all of your units must come from a single army.
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Sammy the Squid
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Back to retirement!

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Well for starters I would hope common sense. And then respect for your oponent and the 30 years of background that just got destroyed?


And GW showed sooo much respect for the 30 years of background :P :lol:
Such a shame... -_-

Is there even anything that says you cannot take multiples of the same named character? Because that could get funny...
"If the squidman can't do it, no one can!!"

Wins/Losses/Draws

Skaven Clan Rattenkrieg - 108/58/20
Dark Elves - 44/14/8
Hochland Empire - 33/14/4
Malkavian Vampires - 23/22/4
Beastmen - 50/25/2

Have not completed a Painting Vow since July 07!!
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Ratty Gnawtail
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Scribble-thing

Sammy the Squid
22nd July 2015 - 02:07 PM
Is there even anything that says you cannot take multiples of the same named character? Because that could get funny...
"And this one?"

"Not-not ready most masterful of masters" whispered the nervous voice of the flesh moulder. The two Skaven moved along to the next growth container that held a dark furred Skaven of impressive physique.

"This one shows much-much promise, though is hard to tell. Remains of original had many fault-things, many-many corruptions. Snee has rebuilt, made bet-better but is slow process."

"But I will have a strikeforce soon?" hissed the other Skaven, an impressive Warlord that made the Skaven in the tank look weak.

"Yes, project Queek shall soon-soon be ready."

"Good-good" Warlord Gnawdwell simply stated and moved to the next tank.


Sorry, couldn't help myself. :P

I think you can take multiples of the same character.
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Helios
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Stormvermin
Ah haha! Can you imagine a game like that?
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Sleboda
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I realize the fluff implications for veterans are...troublesome.

I've just accepted that I need to treat this as something new. Complete and total newness.

I am going to have fun with the idea that the whole idea, the entire purpose, of AoS is "Got cool models? Put 'em on the table, roll dice, and laugh a bit."

I'll treat Kings of War as my "serious" fantasy game, and treat this like Super Dungeon Explore. :)
True scholars have more than just one book to study.
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NiallJC1984
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I too am perplexed why the keyword "unique" doesn't appear anywhere...

It's just all so darn stupid.
"All decent folk find the common rat repulsive. Harbinger of disease, it scavenges on our waste-heaps and frightens our children. How immeasurably worse then is the foul Skaven - standing on its hindlegs in foul parody of a human. Rats as tall as man, and blessed with the most vile intellect and cunning. They are the dark side of our souls, come to destroy us for our sins."
Albrecht of Nuln - Burned at the stake, IC 1301 for pernicious declamation.
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Ratty Gnawtail
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Sleboda
22nd July 2015 - 06:34 PM
I realize the fluff implications for veterans are...troublesome.
Thinking about it, AoS seems to have left a lot of open ended fluff (at least thus far.)

So I guess it leaves the players with a much more open sandbox of a world for their own stories. Perhaps even their own universe and what-ifs.
Though i'm still waiting to hear what the fluff is other than multiple bubble realms, The God Emperor of Man Sigmar, and the good guys going towards smashing Chaos' face in.

At least whatever happens we can always have joke lists of twelve Queeks yelling "Everyone get in here!" and jumping on Thorgrim Grudgebearer.
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