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The unfortunate editing habits of moderators; A discourse on why you shouldn't do what you do...
Topic Started: 28th October 2011 - 07:08 PM (758 Views)
mrtn
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Swashbuckler
From time to time I see that a moderator has added a fun and/or useful comment to another member's post. I think this is a bad habit since there is no way to know that your post has been tampered with other than going back and reread your posts at a later date. This is something I almost never do, so if you've wanted to tell me something it was probably lost in the warp and passed me by. ^o)

The settings I use for UE, and I suppose most others do as well, is that you automatically go to any unread post in a thread when you click on it. Since you read your own post when you posted it you won't know if it's been tampered with.

Either something is worth to post, then post it. If it's not worth to post it, then don't. Personally I think that even a small joke or a one-liner can be worthy of a new post, and if it's a comment on the rules of UE then it's certainly worth a new post so you make sure that the member breaking a rule or missing something obvious get to know about it. Editing in "I merged your double posts" is useless if the double poster never sees it, isn't it? Isn't the point of being a moderator that you actually tell people when they're breaking a rule, so they can stop it?

I think there's a much less condesending way to present this point, and I hope you read this edit to learn from this mistake :P
(Yes, I'm aware of the irony) :lol:
-Vorg


To sum up my points, I hope that you don't edit my posts since I will never see it, I only see when you edit someone else's post, a fact that they probably won't see either. :ermm: I won't begrudge the mods to get a slightly higher post count if that means that most people will actually see what they have to say. :)

Edited by General Vorg, 29th October 2011 - 03:56 AM.
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WillQueek
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LOL, i always check my own and then the first unread one. (if my post was the last one)
I don't mid them editing i normally see it. The reason is the outstanding colours.

but i do am interested in the point of view of the rest.
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Kimzi
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The one and only.
Hmm, I agree here.
Adding a little joke or whatever is okay and can be cute, but if it involves explaining a rule that might have been (accidentally) broken it's better to use a new post, or send a PM to the offender.
It's also quite confusing when you are reading a thread and there are multiple peoples edits in one post responding to each other. PM system is more suited for that I think.
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Ratty Gnawtail
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Totally not a magpie

I think the ability for our great and mighty Council members (may the Horned One protect and keep their twisted spirits) to edit our posts is a wonderful idea! They are funny and informativ...are they gone? Ok then:

The ability for them to edit can be very funny (i.e when muttering about the quality of Silas' Assassins or Matik lending you faulty Optics.) Indeed I am not wholly against it. However mrtn makes a very good point that there is a fair chance you won't read them. On the otherhand I am not moved towards action or change unless a means was created where any Council editing appears via a message box or something. Other than that generally the system isn't perfect but it isn't broken.
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Scarr, Reincarnated
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Well all power to the moderators.

You certainly make a fair point there.
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General Vorg
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That's certainly a fair point, mrtn; the last thing we want to be is useless. There are no cut-and-dry rules for moderators editing posts - we can do so for really any reason, as long as we aren't abusing the power. There are, however, rules for when to PM someone about their posting behavior.

Thus when we need you to pay attention to what we want to say to you, you will definitely receive a PM or will, in some other way, be notified of our issue. If it's simply a joke, then it's more for any random member who happens to stumble upon it and laugh than for you particularly to read it.

Typically if there's an issue requiring attention, we perform two actions, each with its own unique purpose. We will edit (or even delete) the post, letting the membership as a whole know what the issue was and how we responded to it. In addition, we will PM the member in question so said member is personally aware of the issue. Thus both the UnderEmpire understands why we needed to intervene in brief, and the particular member learns why we needed to intervene in detail.

Of course, there have been and there will continue to be Mod-edits without PMs when it would be desirable for the particular member to read the edited post, and sometimes the member won't reread their post. If it was extremely important for the member to read it, they would receive a PM, and thus its only these borderline cases where perhaps a member isn't notified of an issue in their post (like a double-post, for example. Luckily for everyone, Zetaboards automatically combines double-posts). These borderline cases are exactly that: borderline. A member will never be failed to be notified over a post of dire consequences.

No, we will not PM you every time you receive a joke in an edited post. That removes the fun of it! :P

I hope that answers your query. I will make an even more determined effort to PM a member when an mod-edit of one of their posts requires their attention, as will the rest of the Council.

On behalf of the Council of XIII,


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scrivener
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*toot*

That is also more or less my rationale for when I edit posts: usually it's a situation where I may have a point to make but I don't want to make so much of a fuss of it and risk detracting from the original purpose of the thread. In this case the post edit responds to the specific case (e.g. a parrot or spam post) and the broader case (e.g. posting behaviour) is being monitored or dealt with privately via PM. The post edit is not necessarily to inform the targeted poster but to inform the membership at large of our stance on the matter. It may also be pertinent in the case where the targeted post may potentially rub someone the wrong way, so at least the mod's message is there right with the post. In these sort of cases, the post-edit serves us better than a new post (many a hasty retort can be averted if a would-be respondent is aware that the mods are on the case before he goes straight for the reply button).


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Kimzi
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Ah, that makes sense. Thanks for clearing it up guys. :)
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Silas
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The Great Bunny. Now with a mop. :)

Yere what the others have said. I don't think we ever put anything important in a mutate unless it's removal of something and if we remove something we always PM the person.

So even if people do miss us having mutated something into their post it doesn’t matter since if it was only mutated it won’t have been very important. If it was important they would have got a PM about it.

As for your request to not receive any jokes, it has been noted. :P And will be promptly forgotten. :P ~N-VII
Edited by Nurglitch VII, 29th October 2011 - 06:49 PM.
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Skaven Lord Vinshqueek
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Since mrtn has used this way to express his opinion (as did others in reply to his post), I am very curious as to what their opinion now is with the reply from some of my fellow Council members... assuming obviously that this topic was meant to adress and discuss the methods of the moderator team, and not simply throw a comment into the community and leave it at that.

Greetz
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Kimzi
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The one and only.
Yeah me too. For me, things are cleared up and I get it now.

Post, people! Lets discuss.
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Deathmaster Shadow
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I think it keeps people observant, it just adds to the fun of the site, the mods are actually interactive (not that they aren't already) and not high and mighty like mods on other sites
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Kimzi
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I agree with that one. This site is surprisingly well moderated for its size, and the mods are very nice and open.
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Ratty Gnawtail
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Totally not a magpie

The factor that important edits are also notified to the fool-rat forum member overrides the main body of Mrtn's argument. While there is the point that some may not read the "less important edits" as Silas pointed out they are not that overly important. The job of a mod is important and their right to edit posts should not be impinged. Indeed if it were all Hell Pit could break loose! Hence I say that we should stay as we are, change afterall is for Tzeentch.
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mrtn
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Skaven Lord Vinshqueek
31st October 2011 - 09:07 AM
Since mrtn has used this way to express his opinion (as did others in reply to his post), I am very curious as to what their opinion now is with the reply from some of my fellow Council members... assuming obviously that this topic was meant to adress and discuss the methods of the moderator team, and not simply throw a comment into the community and leave it at that.

Greetz
It's exactly the same. I did discuss it with Silas before posting (mainly to ask which forum I should post it in) but I do think it's worthy of debate and to bring to your attention what I think.

Don't edit, post an answer in the thread instead.

I'm a mod on a couple of other forums (Herdstone and COTEC) and I wouldn't edit someone's post without telling them, I think that's rude. Even if I just fix a broken link or something.

Ratty Gnawtail
 
The job of a mod is important and their right to edit posts should not be impinged.

The job of a mod is to help run the forum, not edit in gags in other people's posts. It's not part of the job description and it never should be.
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