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Experiences using large units of Rat Ogres?; Anything to share?
Topic Started: 7th September 2011 - 03:03 PM (697 Views)
Skaven
Clanrat
After finding an absolute steal on ebay, and with help from some Chaos Spawn, Screaming Bell, and HPA bits and pieces, I have almost managed to bring to fruition my dream of a large unit of Rat Ogres. I currently have 12 plus an extra model which I'll be using to convert as a Warlord on Bonebreaker (a unit of 13 seemed quite fitting as well). Not sure how often I'll be using the Bonebreaker, but it may come into play from time to time.
Does anyone have any experience / stories of using such a unit? I know they're not exactly the premier Monstrous Infantry, especially for their cost, but they seem to be OK. I was thinking of running Squeel with them, hopefully to give them regeneration - this wouldn't affect the Bonebreaker, would it? Also, Squeel has to go in the front rank, right, as he's a Master Moulder?
What's their best match-up, assuming they don't get the regeneration roll? Being without armour, I can't imagine they'd fare too well against massed infantry. However they have a high initiative for Monstrous Infantry and I can see them ripping apart Ogres or Kroxigor with relative ease...
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RedPlague
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Chieftain
I will be using a unit of 8 next month in a big battle..to be honest I have never really had a good experience with them but haven't really used them in 8th edition..
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DNA Maniac
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Stormvermin
i newer used them that big and i am not planing to any time soon. But they are a massive power, they hit hard, they hit fast, what else you may wish? :)

I just cant waste the 4th atack of thoose in the 2nd rank. And i wouldnt go for a warlord in them since you will put them in danger to bring out a massive cc damage to enemy, you may wish to prevent a potential lose of a lord. But life is cheap anyway!

Would like to hear about how do they work :)
It's Alive!!! It's Alive!!!
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JollyPuggles


A horde of R.Ogres will bring a lot of pain...and draw a lot of firepower. Unless you get lucky and roll Regen from Skweel, you'll take a lot of punishment up to the point you get into combat. Still, they're Immune to Psych so long as they're Frenzied, so you won't have to worry about Panic at least.

In combat, they'll fare better against common infantry than elites and don't even try to take on anything big, tough or heavily armoured. Against common infantry, with the amount of attacks you're pumping out (10 attacks per 40mm frontage...compared to 6 attacks per 40mm front from a common Horde infantry), you stand a decent chance of kickg butt and taking names. With your high I, you should be able to dent any big units sufficiently to minimise your own losses. Against bigger and tougher things, though, you'll start struggling to amass enough combat res to compensate your lack of banner and ranks, not to mention their higher chance of inflicting casualties back.
Aargh! Ping. ThortFtar!
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Merhotep
Stormvermin

I only have one experience to share, and it was specific to the scenario - a basic GW store "Bring and Battle", where they just divvy all the players who show up into two teams for one big battle.

I brought a unit of 20 (I'm a thousand years old, so I have collected rat ogres here and there since the dawn of warhammer...) to actually run as a horde: six wide, three ranks deep with two in a fourth rank to soak up the first wounds and still have three viable ranks.

Because it was a "Bring and Battle", I counted on my getting allies who I'd rely on to do enough spellcasting, shooting, and war machine attacks to keep me alive, so I brought two enormous slave blocks to pin down prey for the rat ogres, plus a medium clanrat unit in which to hide my army standard and general. Thus this one large unit of rat ogres constituted the bulk of my army points just by itself.

Anyway, I did eventually get to plow into a large overconfident swordmasters unit (NOT in horde formation itself, thankfully!) and even with the hideous damage I took, the four eligible front-line rat ogres and eight more with supporting attacks in the second and third ranks inflicted even worse back onto the swordmasters, broke them, and ran them down. So, at least it worked this one time!

Generally speaking, though, this is probably not a very good allocation of your points, since rat ogres are so expensive and very easily killed. It's probably best to use them only as a rare shock tactic (it's likely your opponent would never suspect your block of 12/13!) when you already have a good idea what your opponent will likely field and that he won't be too tough on your ogres.

Good luck!

Merhotep
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tunnelrunner
Clanrat
I ran a horde of rat ogres in a recent tourney (17 + WL on BB) and they rocked!!!
Only got taken out twice:- Once by a chaos warrior flank charge (which wouldn't have happened if I had remembered to stop the marauders I had been facing), and once by a horde of trolls led by their special character (dud rolls, run down).

Skweel does help a lot tho' if you can take named characters.
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Metacarpi
Clanrat
I've got to confess that I've never even considered this option, just because I've always thought along the lines of:

"for the points cost of a single Rogre, I can field an extra 6 or so CR's, so for a unit of 3x3 Rogres, I could get an extra 54 CR's!"

Looking at some of the stories here though, it looks like I might have to re-evaluate that line of thinking! Also, I think the Rogres (well, at least the ones from IoB and the SB one, I've no experience with the boxset Rogres) are amongst my favourite models to paint, so this gives me an excuse to invest in some! :rogre:
My Warlord on Brood Horror painting log - Let me know what you think!
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Scurrilous
Warlord
My experiences of running Rogres is that they are a lot of points for something that hits like a freight train... sometimes. Maybe even most of the time. But still, there are a number of reasons you don't want to sink those points in, and I'm gonna line them up for you now.

1) Frenzy. Even with SiN and the general nearby you are probably going to be on LD8. If you want them more to the flanks (and they work best on flanks) then it's more likely LD6. In short they are easily baited and hard to control.

2) No saves. No armour, no wards, no nothing. So shooting will hurt you a bit, but combat will hurt you a lot. If you face anything that hits you first or can take what you're dishing out, they'll fold faster than superman on laundry day.

3) They are expensive by the standard of most similar units. 40 points is something we can afford because of cheap infantry but they're not a great deal compared to other Monstrous Infantry.

4) Frenzy, again. If you lose combat you lose a number of attacks and the resistance to the leadership tests that as I mentioned before, they don't do well at. If you use Rogres as a supporting unit to hit flanks, there's always a danger that the slaves/clanrats holding the unit in place will take so many wounds that you'll lose combat. Especially if the enemy unit is thing, stopping your Rogre unit from unleashing the full number of attacks.

So that's about it. They work best in a big group but there are some enemies that they become nothing but a liability. You pretty much NEVER want to run Rogres against a high elf army unless you can be utterly sure you always hit flanks, for example.
Tournemant results to date:
vs Vampire Counts: 1 victory
vs Dwarves: 1 victory
vs Daemons: 1 Draw
vs Brettonians: 1 draw, 1 loss
vs Skaven: 1 victory
vs Lizardmen: 1 victory
vs Dark Elves: 1 loss
vs High Elves: 1 loss
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Koroviev
Clanrat
My standard unit of 5-6 rat ogres is already a huge target that I sometimes feel is overpriced dependent on the opponent. I can't imagine bringing more and it not getting throttled by something nasty quickly.

It will depend on your enemy's magic and the kind of ranged firepower they're packing on how far that horde gets (and also how they roll against your storm banner that you're obviously going to take). I've found my rat ogre unit has the most success against dwarves, Don't even bother trying to fight high elves with this.
Edited by Koroviev, 13th September 2011 - 12:44 AM.
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Paricidas
Doomwheel Driver
Do not run any characters but Mr. Gnawtooth with your Rogers if you are up against cannons. They are monsterous Infantery, and all our characters are Infantery or monsterous cavalery. So you will never get a look out sir.

Ceterum censeo Altdorfem esse delendam
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Sammy the Squid
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Back to retirement!

Im a massive Rat Ogre fan (as some of you may have guessed by me occupying the Clan Moulder seat for so many years!) and I field them in practically every game I play with Skaven. In 6th/7th edition I took small units for support, but since 8th edition I have found my units growing steadily larger. Yet they never seem to do enough damage. This is simply because my opponents are terrified of them, despite their horrendous track record, so they usually get shot to death, or the enemy unit in front of them gets buffed and the Rat Ogres just bounce off them. On the rare occasion they do reach combat totally intact, they have the reputation to fluff their attacks and eventually end up running anyways. But I love Rat Ogres, and they will always be in my army. Maybe Im just not playing with big enough units. My maximum size so far has been 8, but I own around 18 Rat Ogres, so am tempted to start running units of 12/18 with Skweel for exgtra punch (and hopefully getting Regenerate). I plan to test a unit like this on the weekend, and Im hoping I will start to get results from it...

- Sammy
"If the squidman can't do it, no one can!!"

Wins/Losses/Draws

Skaven Clan Rattenkrieg - 108/58/20
Dark Elves - 44/14/8
Hochland Empire - 33/14/4
Malkavian Vampires - 23/22/4
Beastmen - 50/25/2

Have not completed a Painting Vow since July 07!!
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Rakchew
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Hack 'n Slash!
Had a unit of 6 (with MB) take a charge from a horde of like 30-40 TK skeletons. They decimated the unit utterly. I don't think I even lost a Rat Ogre...maybe one?

They are fun to use after you are done "power gaming" with optimized lists. They should definitely get a slight point drop, but that will never happen. Technically they are even more expensive since you have to take packmasters, which normally dont even get to attack...with they somewhat typical 3x2 RO build.

It seems like we are the only Monstrous Infantry unit with no save that also requires a handler to function...ogres/dr.ogres/ch.ogres/krox/ushabti/treekin... can't think of any others off the top of my head.
8th edition Skaven Tournament record 3-2, 2-1, 4-1, 2-1
East Coast Glory
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Sketch
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scratchings and squeakings

I've never really felt all that pushed to field Rat Ogres. Of course, I haven't been playing Skaven for a terribly long time (bout a year) so maybe I just need to acquire a taste for them or somthing...

I've had a good experience of them when a mere two of them took out a unit of Wardancers, a Wood Elf chicken noble and some scouts all by themselves. Since then though I've been kind of leaning away from them a bit. They are horribly vulnerable to missile fire or almost anything that can swing before they can. I'd say there use is pretty situational then. I also find they're a unit that has to be babysat quite a lot. As a sort of a fast moving glass cannon unit their optimal location is arguably somewhere on the flank where they can nip round and deal damage. However, the inevitable panic tests they're going to be inflicted with by missile fire makes them unreliable in this sense due to their frequently low Ld and position outside the Ld bubble. Deploying them centrally leaves you taking the risk that your slaves and clanrats may be on the wrong side of them and with a longer hike to combat as the RO's might be in the way.

I'm thinking a large unit of Rat Ogres could well be effective against low shooting/magic armies. The inclusion of Squeel I'd say is pretty important to attempt to get Regen on them. You'll probably get your points worth on him anyway. I probably would put the Warlord in with them and possibly give him Crown of Command or some similar Ld buff. Line it up opposite Kroxigor or Ogres or suchlike and watch it steamroll them.

It's bound to be fun to use anyway. :)
Raining Blood / M(elrik)atriculation / Twikitch's Triumph
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SkavenDan
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Doomwheel Fanatic
RO either get shot or laughed at. And it's no cheap unit nailing them puts your opponent in a good position to win the game. Cheap and cheerful is the skaven way. You may kill 3 blocks but there are more coming! Army ant attack
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WillQueek
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Got Nerfed
May i suggest Throth the Unclean :rolleyes:

a big Rogre horde as core choise, with skweel, and rats....... *starts dreaming away*
FOR THE GLORY OF THE HORNED RAT OF COURSE!

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