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Vs. Vampire Counts and Ogre Kingdoms?; Both will be a first time for me, any advice?
Topic Started: 21st August 2011 - 07:50 PM (903 Views)
Firby
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Chieftain
Hey guys. Here soon, I will be playing against Vampire Counts and Ogre Kingdoms (not at the same time). I know absolutely nothing about either army, and have never played against them. I was hoping you could give me a little heads up on what I can expect from both armies. I dont want to perfectly plan and counter them, but i would like to know what i am up against. I think it was the chinese who said to 'know thy enemy', lol. More specifically;

1) What are the most common units each army brings, and what special rules do they have?

2) What is the primary playing style of those armies (shooting, magic, horde, etc...)

3) How effective are HPA's vs VC and OK? How about WLC's?

4) Will my usual tactics work well or get crushed (slaves/clanrats/stormvermin to soak numbers and tarpit, hpa and wlc for kill power, rat darts for hunting, and several engineers with warplightning for more kill power).
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WillQueek
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FirbyClaw
21st August 2011 - 07:50 PM
1) What are the most common units each army brings, and what special rules do they have?

2) What is the primary playing style of those armies (shooting, magic, horde, etc...)

3) How effective are HPA's vs VC and OK? How about WLC's?

4) Will my usual tactics work well or get crushed (slaves/clanrats/stormvermin to soak numbers and tarpit, hpa and wlc for kill power, rat darts for hunting, and several engineers with warplightning for more kill power).
OK:

1) Bulls, ironguts, gnoblars, gnoblar trappers, sracplauncher.

2) units around 6-12 or 12-24 in horde, gnoblars are like slaves with stand & shoot, trappers are skirmishers, srappy's are catapult with str. 2 killing blow.

3) HPA work well us ulsual

4) dunno, never played with skaven vs Ogres......
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Scarr, Reincarnated
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11th creator of the Skaven Achievements. Binder of IceAc.
Both armies like to use of Death Stars.

OK often use very big (and expensive) Hordes of either normal Bulls or Ironguts. These hit with insane amounts of attacks and I don't think a 50 block of Slaves will hold it for one round. The easiest way to deal with it is to blast it away with everything you have. This is about the only thing you need to worry about (sort of) when facing them. They will of course get a new book and the situation may change, but that's after your game.

VC have quite expensive units, but they can resurrect them sometimes faster than you can kill them. The Vampires hit very hard and they are also very good at magic. They can choose from every lore except Life with one of their Vampiric Powers, but their own lore is still very good becouse of some spells. "Vanhel's" is one of these and it's basically a free move and extra fighting potential in one spell for a very low casting cost. Their Grave Guard and Blood Knights may be used as Death Stars.
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blader4411
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Hell Pit is decent vs. VC, make sure to have Spikes to avoid being bogged down by unkillable ethereal units. It's good vs. OK right now due to I4, but that may change with the new book.

As for playstyles, Ogres favour a fast, combat army supported by Gut Magic.
Vampires can be either fighty, magic-oriented or a mixture, so are the more versatile. They have no shooting though (other than a banshee).

-Blader
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Rakchew
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Hack 'n Slash!
The VC player will most likely have the 4+ regen banner on a nice big unit of Grave Guard (who have killing blow/magical attacks). Ghouls are similar to our plague monks (-frenzy, +poison), but cannot take a musician or standard.

If you play with a good number of Weapon teams watch out for Winds of Undeath as it hits every unit of yours on a 4+ causing a wound, then creating ethereal units with taht many wounds left.

If the VC player is using a bunker (20+ strong unit with Characters in it, behind the main lines), hit it with everything you have one turn then slam it with Curse of the Horned rat to wipe out all his characters.

Haven't seen many players use Blood Knights lately (since they are expensive in both game terms and in real life...) but a deathstar with these guys and 4+ regen and Vampire with sword that gives wounds back is quite devastating. They do have pretty low leadership (7 i think) and frenzy so can be baited quite reliably.
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ratboy1018
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Ogre models have multiple wounds, so........ take items that do multiple wounds. They are fast and do impact hits when charging over 6in i think.

VC rely on the leader. KILL HIM QUICKLY! Easier said than done I know, but if you have a goal in mind it's easier to reach. Once he's (re)dead the army will start to crumble.
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DNA Maniac
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Stormvermin
Always grab a brass orb if you havent already. Its great againest both armies since they have low Initiative values.

And againest VC try firepower focus. Dont try to lower their numbers, wipe out a whole in a round otherwise its kinda useless to shoot(&magic) at all.
Edited by DNA Maniac, 21st August 2011 - 09:33 PM.
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WillQueek
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ratboy1018
21st August 2011 - 09:20 PM
VC rely on the leader. KILL HIM QUICKLY! Easier said than done I know, but if you have a goal in mind it's easier to reach. Once he's (re)dead the army will start to crumble.
Good point i remember

WLC= BOOM! (with a LoS likely)

Gutter runner it.

assasinate it

doomwheel it.

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Demonrat Thing
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The Bloated
Ogres: WLC, Doomwheel, Abom all good choices. Stormvermin are a good choice against them as well for the S4 attacks. WFT's are a must against them. S5 multiple wounds (d3), whats not to like?

Vampires: An Assassin is the way to go. Use him to seek out his Lord. WFT's are good to take against his Regen'd Guard/Blood Knights. Abom with spikes is nice to take on pretty much anything you throw at it. The only thing to worry about is their magic and Ghouls. A few WFT's and the Ghouls are toast. Do not let his ghouls contact your HPA. It will die. Poison is it's bane. One more thing. Take out any corpse carts too. Balefire hurts our magic. WFT's are good for these too. 3 WFT's should do it for your army.
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Silas
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The Great Bunny. Now with a mop. :)

*Waves magic council mop*

*BAMF*

Skitterleaped to tactics. Have a nice day. :)
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THE BUNNY WILL EAT!!!
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Grey Seer Exahm
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Gribbly
I'm surprised someone is playing Ogre Kingdoms this close to the new book being released.

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avenger649
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DNA Maniac
21st August 2011 - 09:32 PM
Always grab a brass orb if you havent already. Its great againest both armies since they have low Initiative values.

And againest VC try firepower focus. Dont try to lower their numbers, wipe out a whole in a round otherwise its kinda useless to shoot(&magic) at all.
Not exactly true. It is pointless killing skeletons and zombies with it. The vampires are at least initiative six and raise up troops you kill with it.
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My blades will be upon you soon.

Then you will be bathed in warp-fire.

*Laughs evilly*


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