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How to improve our units; The sucky ones.
Topic Started: 16th August 2011 - 03:32 PM (1,071 Views)
Grey Seer Exahm
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Gribbly
As topic title says. We have several units that are a bit naff, so suggestions on how to make them harder, better, faster, stronger while keeping things balanced

Verminlord - Drop to around 300-odd points. Maybe make some of his skills upgrades.
Plague Censor Bearers - Drop to about 12 points. Vanguard?
Night Runners - WS4, whole unit gets 6+ dodge save.

Just some to start things off.
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RedPlague
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Chieftain
Ratling gun should go back to auto hits :( or at least have a +1 to hit to make it more viable.
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Razuli
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Grey Seer
12 points would be alittle too much of a points decrease for PCBs, they aren't THAT bad off. Maybe 5-6 points at most. Also, with the VL a 300 point drop is too much as well. If anything, if his Ward got better he'd probally be worth the points we have to spend for him now, though it would be cool if we could kit him like greater deamons. Night runners I can agree with.
Edited by Razuli, 16th August 2011 - 06:09 PM.
skavenmatt,Sep 11 2010
10:05 PM
Playing skaven to minimize randomness is like going to prom with your sister, you can do it if you really want, but in the end everyone will still laugh even if you do get lucky.


Clanlord Trask
18th April 2011 - 03:46 AM
I always take at least one Warpfire Thrower. You can't always rely on your opponent to do massive damage to your troops. Sometimes, you just have to do a job yourself.

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WillQueek
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Got Nerfed
Ok to start the vermin lord i think of:

- Avatar of the horned one: 4+, or even 3+ wardsave.....
- T6
- Point cost drop.


with Jezzails:

- point drop



Censers:

-point drop
- vangaurd sounds pretty good and fitting. or like nigthrunners.....



Globas:

- Template back
- Vangaurd maybe, or like nigthrunners.....
FOR THE GLORY OF THE HORNED RAT OF COURSE!

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Scarr, Reincarnated
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11th creator of the Skaven Achievements. Binder of IceAc.
Jezzails should have BS 4, then I would use them seriously.

Globadiers I think are at a good placement in terms of points. I think that Immune to Psychology or something similar would help them. 10 points is not that much for a Special unit. Actually I would like them in Core at a cost of 8 a piece.

Vermin lord needs to be dropped to about 400 points and get a 4+ ward save. Everything gets blasted by cannons. Do not complain that "they would die to cannonballs all day", what you should do is to think of ways to nerf cannons, as I think they hit to easily.

Plague Censor Bearers needs Initiative 4. The best way to make them better should be to have better "combat-helping" magic that reduces Initiative in some way.

Night Runners - Killing Blow.
The Pox on you, AND your kind!

Player of games, watcher of games, gamer of plays.


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Skaven
Clanrat
The Vermin Lord should not get a 4+ ward save. All other Greater Daemons have a 5+ ward save - why should the Vermin Lord be the one exception? I'd agree with T6, though, and a points drop. Maybe 400 - 425 points. Ratling gun should go back to auto-hits. Globadiers should be more expensive and use small templates or something, currently they're virtually useless. Jezzails could do with being a couple of points cheaper. Stormvermin could be 1 point cheaper I reckon.
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RedPlague
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Chieftain
Thought of a good one,

Our Warpfire throwers should get the opportunity to roll the artillery dice twice to increase the range..

Double the chance of misfire, double the chance of reward...sounds like skaven no?
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Slide Shade
Chieftain
Individual templates on PWGs would be far too powerful, unless they were made vastly more expensive (and at that point they'd become a victory points bonanza since small units of skirmishers are relatively easy to kill) or the templates were significantly decreased in power. I could see them having some special rule where they get a template for every group of X models in the unit, though.

I'd like for them to get some variety of warplock pistols. It wouldn't make them vastly more effective, but it would give them a shooting attack sooner (10-12" instead of 8") and be a neat way of depicting them as Skryre special forces (which is my preferred way of imagining them).

Night Runners should get the option to upgrade to scouts.

Doomflayer should be S5 instead of S4, with a minor price increase if necessary.
Scarr, Reincarnated
16th August 2011 - 10:50 PM

Night Runners - Killing Blow.
Why should they be better fighters than Gutter Runners? Makes no sense.
Edited by Slide Shade, 17th August 2011 - 08:12 AM.
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WillQueek
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Got Nerfed
Globadiers

-Unit size: 5-20
-Bs 4?
- globe-bombard: For every 10 models a small template. Middle must be within 8 inches. Scatters D6 or D3?
FOR THE GLORY OF THE HORNED RAT OF COURSE!

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scratchydoom
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I think the Ratling should hit on a 3+, auto hit was overpowered before....
Doom flayer needs more wounds! its a combat weapon and seems to suck ass! it was designed to break dwarf shield walls, i can see it chargeing once and then dying.... not much of a formation breaker
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Scarr, Reincarnated
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Slide Shade
17th August 2011 - 08:11 AM
Scarr, Reincarnated
16th August 2011 - 10:50 PM

Night Runners - Killing Blow.
Why should they be better fighters than Gutter Runners? Makes no sense.
Gutter Runners could also have it. You use your Gutter Runners with Slings most of the time anyway.

Weapon Teams should be able to replace members after one is killed or something. The same with Jezzails.
The Pox on you, AND your kind!

Player of games, watcher of games, gamer of plays.


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Slide Shade
Chieftain
Killing Blow would still be way too powerful. Night Runners would suddenly become one of the best + most powerful units of infantry in the game, and people would stop using Clanrats altogether.

I like the point about weapon teams, though. Each weapon team should have two wounds, it's only sensible. Even if the second wound comes with a rule about the team not being able to move, or having to take a turn to reload in between shots, after the first crew member is lost.
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Scarr, Reincarnated
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Slide Shade
17th August 2011 - 06:14 PM
Killing Blow would still be way too powerful. Night Runners would suddenly become one of the best + most powerful units of infantry in the game, and people would stop using Clanrats altogether.
Bloodletters and Executioners also have it. If Night Runners were upped to 9-10 points each would it not be underpriced?
The Pox on you, AND your kind!

Player of games, watcher of games, gamer of plays.


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scratchydoom
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I really dont think that night runner should have killing blow. I think it would be cool if they had a 6+ dodge save, hand weapon and the option to take a net that would up their dodge save to 5+ in combat, as well as having detrimental effects on the enemy unit (-1 initiative or WS) then they would be great as a support unit :P

something to that degree :P or perhaps for Gutter runners... (i think the nets they get, that count as shields should add to their current save 6+ save (hand weapon plus shield equals 6+ save due to parry))
Edited by scratchydoom, 19th August 2011 - 10:15 AM.
Scratch the enganuative
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Flem
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A blood curling cough a day, keeps the assassins away

Night runners would be alot better if slinking advance was alterd into vanguard. plus the option that a nightleader could take smok bombs.

Flem,
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