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0+ Armor Save?; Is it legal?
Topic Started: 9th August 2011 - 03:20 PM (1,268 Views)
Rakchew
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So in the rules FAQ/Errata they have,

Page 43 – Saving Throws
Change the third paragraph to “Note that a save of any kind
can never be better than 1+. This does not prevent a model
having items or special rules that would take the save even
lower, it simply caps the saving throw at 1+. Also, remember
that a roll of 1 is always a failure.”

Yet, in the WoC army book it states that an eye of the gods roll can take this beyond that to 0+. Can ANY save be lowered beyond 1+ or is that just a specific benefit to WoC rolling on the EOTG table? My buddies played a game the other day where his hero on juggernaut had a base 0+ and my other buddy was saying thats not legal.

I get from the errata that you can never have better than 1+, though if an item/rule would give you a better save you could still take that item/rule you would just not benefit from the save bonus.
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SkavenDan
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The army book takes present so he can have a 0+ but a 1 always fails to save.
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WillQueek
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Yes it's legal, but i fails on a 1 so you could have a -243 save, and still fail on a 1
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CapAmr05
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Yes, warriors can have a 0+ save thanks to their EotG rolls, however they do indeed still fail on the roll of a 1. That doesn't sound like such a drastic advantage to a 1+ or even 2+ save, until you take into account the following...

The benefit that a 0+ save gives is that the save margain is even higher. A strength 5 hit only takes them to a 2+ (still failing only on 1's). It's not until strength 6 that you actually start making their armor save more difficult to pass (i.e. 0+ -3 = 3+).

There may be one or two items/effects in a few other (older) army books that specifically grant a better than 1+ save, but they're rare, and none come to immediately to mind.

--Cap
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Rakchew
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So ..they can only get it from their EOTG rolls because it allows you to overwrite the main rulebook entry? Or am I reading that errata wrong, because the wording to me seems to say that no matter what it caps at 1+, but then again specific army books override the main rule book.

I guess my question is, can anyone have better than 1+ or can you only go below that with "special" rules/items that take precedence over the main rulebook.

My friend had a fighty chaos hero, on juggernaut (+3 to AS), with Chaos Armor and shield (+4 to AS) = 0+

And yes Cap, that is exactly the reason why its so nasty. You have to have S6 for even a 1/3 chance to get through the AS, but then you find out he also had the Dawnstone....*shudders*


Edit** oh and can we add an "Ask Cap" section to the forums, haha. Thanks for all the clarity over the years brother. **
Edited by Rakchew, 9th August 2011 - 04:32 PM.
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CapAmr05
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Quote:
 
I guess my question is, can anyone have better than 1+ or can you only go below that with "special" rules/items that take precedence over the main rulebook.


The later, you need something specifically written in the armybook to say you can have a 0+ (which the EotG does).

A character combining armor is capped out at 1+, anything additional would be a waste of armor (unless he's anticipating losing a piece of armor later on, then it could help keep him at 1+ I guess).

MTTE: No problem buddy, just trying to help.

--Cap
Edited by CapAmr05, 9th August 2011 - 06:21 PM.
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SkavenDan
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Yes it's annoying but you can hit him with a plague claw or mortar or PCBs (PCBs not the most popular choice but I still enjoy them)
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Flem
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SkavenDan
9th August 2011 - 07:19 PM
Yes it's annoying but you can hit him with a plague claw or mortar or PCBs (PCBs not the most popular choice but I still enjoy them)
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SkavenDan
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True but he is unlikely to be running around on his own. But saying that I did once nail a lvl 4 wizard after killing his unit with globadiers.
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RedPlague
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Just reread the rulebook and yeah says you can't have a save better than 1+..

so technically you can have items that will give you a 0+ but you will only actually have a 1+

I guess the benefit now would be in case someone un magicked one of your items that give you the benefit eg vauls unmaking?
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CapAmr05
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Quote:
 
so technically you can have items that will give you a 0+ but you will only actually have a 1+


That is Incorrect, the Armybook rules trump the Rulebook rules in the event of a conflict (See Page 11 of the Rulebook). So if an item/rule in the Armybook specifically says you can have a 0+ save, then you can have a 0+ save.

--Cap
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RedPlague
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Chieftain
CapAmr05
10th August 2011 - 02:33 PM
Quote:
 
so technically you can have items that will give you a 0+ but you will only actually have a 1+


That is Incorrect, the Armybook rules trump the Rulebook rules in the event of a conflict (See Page 11 of the Rulebook). So if an item/rule in the Armybook specifically says you can have a 0+ save, then you can have a 0+ save.

--Cap
What army item specifies a 0+ AS ??

I haven't come across any?
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CapAmr05
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Warriors of Chaos, it's been discussed for the entirety of this thread starting with the OP:

Quote:
 
Yet, in the WoC army book it states that an eye of the gods roll can take this beyond that to 0+.


--Cap
Edited by CapAmr05, 10th August 2011 - 04:29 PM.
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Ratarsed
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CapAmr05
10th August 2011 - 04:26 PM
Warriors of Chaos, it's been discussed for the entirety of this thread starting with the OP:
Any others? Magic items? Spells? Or is already having a 1+ armour save and rolling +1 armour save on the EotG the only way?
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CapAmr05
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Warriors is the only one I know of, there might be a few others out there lurking around though.

--Cap
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