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Tactical Help against Beastmen; First game in 8th against them
Topic Started: 10th January 2011 - 06:47 AM (562 Views)
Velvetpaws
Breeding Pit Interloper
Anyone got generic advice in playing Beastmen these days? Last time I played them they were skirmishing herds with the ambush rule. Now it looks like they are all ranked up and quite hard.

What should I look out for, and what are some list builds and/or tactics that might work well. I'm looking at a a 2500 point game.

Thanks for any help!

Neek! Neek!

Velvetpaws
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chieftainskritchskritch
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The Freshmaker

In my experience, the Beastmen are like a crappier version of the Warriors of Chaos - very little in the way of shooting, mid-level magic and access to only a select few lores and very CC oriented. Most armies generally consist of a hitty General (either a Beastlord or Minotaur) tricked out to either smash characters/units 7 ways from Sunday or else given enough armour/wards/upgrades to make hurting them next to impossible, backed up by a few ranked CC units (usually Gors), an elite unit (Bestigors or super-hitty Minotaurs), one or two monster units (Minotaurs again) and usually at least one big gribbly (tends to be either a Jabberslyth or Ghorgon). Also note that, like most WOC armies, most RnF units will be led by a Wargor where possible to increase CC potential.

The best way to overcome the Beastmen is to treat them the same way you would WOC: use your superior shooting to whittle down their numbers/ bring down the big monsters. Magic should be used to nullify the Beast-player's magic (essentially his only form of "shooting" attack), and to throw the odd spell at units who look like they might threaten you. Avoid who you dont want to fight by either running around them (using your better Movement value) or else bogging them down in Slaves. Essentially, use target priority - kill the nastiest stuff first with shooting/magic (Minotaurs, Bestigor, anything with Large Target in its profile, etc), and swamp whatever is left.

As a side note, dont worry about the Ambush rule - it tends to be VERY hit and miss, and most competitive Beast players dont bother with it.
You kids these days have it so easy, what with your Plague Furnaces and your Hellpit Abominations and your Bonebreaker Warlords. Back in MY day, all we had was Slaves and Clanrats!...and auto-hit Ratling Guns...and skirmishing Jezzails...and 2D6 Warp Lightning...and Lead From The Back...wait, what was my arguement again?
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Sammy the Squid
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Back to retirement!

I have just completed building my own 2500pt Beastman army. I dont use Minos or bigger things because really they dont do enough damage to break enemy units, especially in 8th ed with loads of attacks back. Really, they cause carnage, but unless used with ranked units, they probably wont be a game winner. Here is what you should watch out for:

Bestigors. These guys are BRUTAL in 8th edition. I honestly cant think of a unit that has benefited more from 8th edition. Fighting in 2 ranks and 'step up' allows them to dish out a horrific number of high strength attacks, and the reroll to Primal fury now granted by the army's BSB means they will hit most of the time. My Bestigors have thumped basically anything they have fought, one time managing to kill 10 Grave Guard in a single round of combat. Aim your guns at these boys, and this is coming from a guy who doesnt like going shooting/magic heavy. But you need to cut Bestigor units down a bit before tackling them in combat.

Wildform spell, default for Law of Beasts. When combining this spell with T4 Beastmen, all of a sudden even their most basic units become scary. The humble Gor will end up with s4 t5, which makes them deadly. Being a Signature spell, it can also be taken on multiple wizards. Watch out for it, especially in combats you need to win.

Razorgor Chariots. These guys are tanks. T5, 5 wounds, and enough high strength attacks to win combat against ranked units. The Pumba's pulling them also benefit from Primal Fury (since the rule is stated for the whole model), so they are capable of causing horrific casualties on the charge. Sure, they may not be able to break Steadfast units, but thats why you combo-charge with Gors. Try to avoid getting double-charged, and maybe tie them up with a nice juicy unit of Slaves. Id say shoot them, but unless you have a gunline you will probably already be using your shooting capabilities on other units such as Bestigor or Minotaur...

Those are basically my 3 key 'tactics' when playing with my Beastmen, and they work well. Ive also heard that massive Ungor units led by a BSB with the Beast Banner can be brutal, but I havent tried that for myself yet so cant comment...

- Sammy
"If the squidman can't do it, no one can!!"

Wins/Losses/Draws

Skaven Clan Rattenkrieg - 108/58/20
Dark Elves - 44/14/8
Hochland Empire - 33/14/4
Malkavian Vampires - 23/22/4
Beastmen - 50/25/2

Have not completed a Painting Vow since July 07!!
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Velvetpaws
Breeding Pit Interloper
Thanks for the advice, felow vermin! I'm upping the shooting in my army! 2 units of 5 Jezzails, 9 PWGs, one WFT, and one Poisoned Wind Mortar.

Do you think two units of 65 Slaves, each with a 15 pt. WLE leader are enough? I'll also have a couple units of clannies, a slave diverting unit, 30 giant rats, and the big boys: furnace and Abomb.
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catandy
Clanrat
Velvetpaws
Jan 11 2011, 06:29 AM
Thanks for the advice, felow vermin!  I'm upping the shooting in my army!  2 units of 5 Jezzails, 9 PWGs, one WFT, and one Poisoned Wind Mortar. 

?!? No Warp Lightning cannons?!?

Against beasties they really are a must. They will earn their points back alot easier than your jezzails - who has really been nerfed in 8th.

Doomwheel is another one I'd suggest you bring along - your opponent has next to no shooting, and 3 multiwound shots per round really comes in handy.

If you decide to bring a furnace (I wouldn't). Beware his general who will most likely wipe the board with it in the first round of combat.

65 slaves are maybe a little too much I'd suggest units of 50 with a musician (reform) and no WLE! If you put an engineer in the slaves you can't fire into melee - and shooting into melee is so much fun ^_^.

To sum it up:

Depending on how friendly the game is I would bring 2 WLC and a doomwheel.

If its very friendly - don't.

Finding the points:

Dump the jezzails and PWG's
As the Old Greyseer was lying on his deathbed he passed on a few words of wisdom to his son:

- War is not about winning son, its about your opponents losing more than you do.

- But dad, if your opponents lose more than you do, you still win the battle, so its all the same, isn't it?

- You are so young my son.....worthy opponents are on your side of the battlefield.....
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Flem
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A blood curling cough a day, keeps the assassins away

Against beastmen another unit that will earn back it's points are gutter runners. With their poisen slings they are perfect for taking out all the big stuff a Beastmen can field as they have no saves.

Perhaps even take a unit of Censer bearers, ok they have been nerfed in 8th but they still pack a good punch against every thing with equal or less I. With 3A on a strenght of 5 the first turn of combat even though most beastmen have a T4, they die rather easy against censers.

Why 2 times 5 jezzails? why even jezzails at all after their nerf? i'd replace those 5 jezzails for a cannon or perhaps extra weapon teams.

units of 65 slaves? seems like overkill to me :P i mostly field 40 and they've never failed me thus far.

The bigest pain you can face in a beastmen army is that doombull with his re-rollable armour save that can make an attack for each succesfull AS. With each save giving him an extra attack he'll win combat and boost his bloodgreedy kin he's with.

Flem,
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reddogfish77
Grey Seer
look there is a trap here as well... watch out for minotaurs... dont run slaves into them... hit them from afar with WLCs and doomwheels.

every combat they win they get an extra attack... if you run slaves into them they will chew through them for a few rounds of combat end up with 6 or 7 attacks each and then move onto something you really dont want them to fight.

use slaves against the bestigors... they are pretty dear and will do as many wounds to slaves as they would to stormvermin.

i would also look out for harpies... they will take out your weapons teams and jezzails qucik smart.
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Velvetpaws
Breeding Pit Interloper
catandy
Jan 11 2011, 02:53 AM
?!? No Warp Lightning cannons?!?


Sorry, my bad -- I have one WLC in my list -- I just forgot to mention it in my post. I think I will take a doomwheel and drop the number of slaves, as you suggest. It's a playoff game in my league, but I don't want to be too unfriendly, so I think I'll keep it at one WLC. I want my opponent to have fun, and if he never gets into hth, he won't enjoy the game at all. Nobody likes to just get shot to death for an entire game!
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