Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
Add Reply
8th edition how to deal with fanatics; skaven newcomer needs help with fanatics
Topic Started: 16th December 2010 - 07:44 AM (1,088 Views)
Kritch Wormtail
Clanrat
hello all,

ive been playing skaven since island of blood (so im really new to this) and i have the skaven island of blood, a unit of stormvermin, and a battalion. my friend also started a goblin army, and my main problem is his fanatics, is ther something really obvious im missing, or are they just amazing, yes i know that they can go back into there own units but without that factor, i am looking for a way to counter them

glory to the horned rat
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Halceon
Member Avatar
Theoretical warp-physicist
Use throwaway units - screen your advances with cheap, small, slave units, barely dressed engineers and other nasties that cost you very little, but draw the fanatics out. (unless they aren't mandatory, in which case it's been to long since my last fight against them).
-Warpfire breather and propagandist Halceon
Torquemada
 
Wherever Halceon is, i'm sure he's looking down on us right now. No, he's not dead, mind you, he's just very condescending.


The exploits of Clan Aiza
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Paricidas
Doomwheel Driver
Well, you are a little limited on slave-models, if I see this right (bataillion + IOB are how many models, 80?) In any other situation it would of course be the best to just get a unit of 20 slaves into 8 inches reach and let them come...

But since 20 models will make 25% of the whole army (if i am informed correctly) that is quite a sacrifice. Therefore I would go anothe rpath and do one of the following:

1. The monks in the Battailon box have enough rats in it to built some nice small units of giant rats. Take them as small as possible (5+1 = 21 points) and run them into the first unit of nightgoblins that comes their way.

pro:
extremly cheap, 23 points
very fast, m6

con:
The giant rats are dead for sure
Can cause panic
Cannot charge nightgoblins with bows because of the Stand&shoot

2. get skitterleap (how you do that is up to you, obviously a grey seer is the simpliest way to get it)

Skitterleap an engineer into the goblin masses by round 1 and let the fanatcis carve through their own army (a clever O&G player will of course not let this happen or if it happens, he will release his fanatics in a direction that is not totally devastating for himself)
Ceterum censeo Altdorfem esse delendam
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Kritch Wormtail
Clanrat
from the battalion ive made 20 slaves and then i have two units of 20 clanrats with spears and shields and one with hand weapons and shields, i then have everything else u named. currently my friend has 5 fanatics in his army equalling 125 points but eventually hes going for 6 units of 20 spearman each with 3 fanatics. so its gonna be hard to handle that, i also recently converted a plague claw catapult, so now my armyies a bit bigger. i also forgot last time to mention that i have a screaming bell aswell.

thanks for the help guys, keep it coming, so far i like the idea of the giant rats, so ill see what i can do.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
CapAmr05
Member Avatar


More slaves is always the best answer.

A little used tactic in ridding yourself of fanatics in a straight up fight (no scouts/ infiltrators pulling them backwards) is to literally march your unit ontop of one.

You take twice as many hits (thus twice as many casualties) for stopping ontop of these little guys, but it's better than taking three (or more) rounds of strikes from it, or worse having it plow into your more important units in the backfield.

Just poise yourself with a wide and deep battle formation prior to the release of the fanatics (so that depending on where they land, one of your units will have a route to it); then in your movement phase grin and push the most sacrificial unit you have ontop of the fanatic. After you've taken care of most or all of them, you can collapse your battle line and proceed with your assault.

Skaven are the prime army for dealing with fanatics in this way because our numbers are so large and we have a variety of sacrificial classed units.

--Cap
Lonewolf Grand Tournament April 28-30

The Beer Phase Podcast

Clan Skrittar
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Paricidas
Doomwheel Driver
CapAmr05
Dec 16 2010, 04:42 PM
More slaves is always the best answer.

A little used tactic in ridding yourself of fanatics in a straight up fight (no scouts/ infiltrators pulling them backwards) is to literally march your unit ontop of one.

You take twice as many hits (thus twice as many casualties) for stopping ontop of these little guys, but it's better than taking three (or more) rounds of strikes from it, or worse having it plow into your more important units in the backfield.

Just poise yourself with a wide and deep battle formation prior to the release of the fanatics (so that depending on where they land, one of your units will have a route to it); then in your movement phase grin and push the most sacrificial unit you have ontop of the fanatic. After you've taken care of most or all of them, you can collapse your battle line and proceed with your assault.

Skaven are the prime army for dealing with fanatics in this way because our numbers are so large and we have a variety of sacrificial classed units.

--Cap

A s suicidal as this tactic sounds, it makes some sense :)

At least if you only have to fight nightgoblins with the rest of your army...
Ceterum censeo Altdorfem esse delendam
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
CapAmr05
Member Avatar


It works for me every time.

The advantage in walking all over them is you get to choose how the hits are passed around your units, because you are the one moving that particular unit on top of them. That way no one unit suffers multiple hits (from 2, 3, 4 or 5 fanatic) because randomization of the fanatic's directions had your unit in the wrong spot that turn.

--Cap
Lonewolf Grand Tournament April 28-30

The Beer Phase Podcast

Clan Skrittar
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
IronShark
Member Avatar
Warlord
Just throwing in a little math, a Fanatic that does 2D6 hits will average 7 hits, which will average about 6 dead slaves; 12 pts. A fanatic is 25pts. Using slaves to 'sit' on fanatics to kill them ends in our favour.
No battle plan survives contact with Clan Skryre.
-Lord Pox
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Kritch Wormtail
Clanrat
that sounds good, but ive still gotta deal with two rock lobbas and a giant :(.

could i put 5 giant rats and 1 packmaster on top of the fanatics, this way they wont panic because theyll most likely all die and the fanatics die aswell?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Scurrilous
Warlord
A unit totally destroyed causes panic to units near it too don't they?

I've never had to fight fanatics yet but more slaves is a good plan.
Tournemant results to date:
vs Vampire Counts: 1 victory
vs Dwarves: 1 victory
vs Daemons: 1 Draw
vs Brettonians: 1 draw, 1 loss
vs Skaven: 1 victory
vs Lizardmen: 1 victory
vs Dark Elves: 1 loss
vs High Elves: 1 loss
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Kritch Wormtail
Clanrat
thing is, im playing him on in 2 days so not much of a chance of more slaves, my plan is for 6 units of 5 giant rats with packmasters, three of the units will draw them out and then the remainders with there high movement will kill the fanatics as he only has five, 3 in one unit and 2 in the other.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
CapAmr05
Member Avatar


A rat pack (or any skaven unit other than slaves or weapon teams) totally destroyed by Fanatics will cause panic.

Any rat pack that somehow survived the 2d6 hits for sitting on one will most likely flee (unless it's within your command bunker) potentially spreading panic as they go.

If you plan to use the ratpack technique be wary of your flee paths, and the 6" panic radius that each unit will have.

Even clanrats can be used to sit on fanatics (another good tactic when slaves are out of position to aid you), casualties are going to happen one way or another; as long as they are happening at your discretion you can keep them favorable to your battle plan.

--Cap

Lonewolf Grand Tournament April 28-30

The Beer Phase Podcast

Clan Skrittar
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
skavenmatt
Stormvermin
I enjoy the skitterleaping a naked engineer between goblin units method. They tie themselves up, wait for the fanatics to kill each other, kill their own units in bad movement, or squash em themselves. Then you can sit slave units on top of them if you really want to. You can never have too many slaves.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Kritch Wormtail
Clanrat
even if i do skitterleap that engineer to the goblins, can't my opponenet still send then towards me and not bother with the engineer :blink:
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Rakashani
Warlord
I was also going to suggest the engineer.

Yes, he can ignore the engineer but you should be doing this while your army is still 24" from him. He's unlikely to get you, even in two turns and he risks the fanatics roling doubles or even coming back at him.

If you were running a different army I would suggest running at him with small, light units who have high movement (e.g. Fast Cav) so that the Fanatics have time to move randomly away from you before you are in range of them. You can simulate this with 40 points of Slaves (20 models), a single 15 point engineer, 10 Nightrunners or maybe small rat swarms. The benefit of the Engineer is with Skitterleap he can effectively get *way* over there quickly... Other units are just not going to be that much ahead of the rest of your line (if you're trying to advance everything) and then your opponent has a much higher chance of getting into something else that you care about....
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Go to Next Page
« Previous Topic · Fantasy Battles Rules Discussion · Next Topic »
Add Reply