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Which weapon team is the best; Which weapon team is the best and why?
Topic Started: 15th December 2010 - 12:56 PM (1,321 Views)
FinaGlista
Clanrat
What do you thing which weapon team us the best and why, i have just started to play Skaven and i am a bit lost here :blink: So i hope you can help me with my decision?
As i can see on your Army lists, ther is almost always a Warpfire Thrower or Poisoned Wind Mortar, what obout others?
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Atropos
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You're posting in the army list section. I guess a mod will move this to the right place :lol:

WFT and PWM are the most common choices nowadays. Both are very nasty. I believe there's no such thing as a "better" something, just "more favored" options when facing different situations.

For instance, if you're facing Elves, IMO the WFT should perform better. The template can hit a lot of them, ignoring their AS (speaking about infantry). Phoenix Guard is another thing though... That's where my 13th Spell says hello :D
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chiaroscuros
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Warlord
Both the WFT and PWM are fragile and easily killed. But they are still better than any other weapon you can get in your core slot.

If you are taking a couple cannons already, the PWM further boosts the stand back and shoot ability. And since the cannons are a greater threat, your opponent may ignore the PWM.

If you are not taking cannons, then the PWM(s) will instantly become a fire magnet and disappear.

Snce the WFT is not a threat from a distance, it is easy to ignore/overlook until your opponent is too close. So some love it.

But here is my advice. Only take WFT or PWM if your rare slots are full. Until then, spend the points on cannons or HPA or doomwheels. And if you are spending points on clanrat units just to get the WFT or PWM (or any of the other weapon team options), you may want to rethink that... bigger units and more slaves are almost always a better choice.
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Malidsol
Clanrat
How viable is a strategy based around getting as many weapon teams as possible onto the field? Pretty much a clan rat-weapon team only army.
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scrivener
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*toot*

Malidsol
Dec 15 2010, 11:19 PM
How viable is a strategy based around getting as many weapon teams as possible onto the field? Pretty much a clan rat-weapon team only army.

I'd say not really, or it'd have to be at least something with a wide variety of weapon teams and a very, very clever plan. Weapon teams are meant to be support troops, they are very fragile and easily killed, as Chiaro said, and the only thing they can provide in a battle is generally just firepower (besides the doomflayer and the warpgrinder). Each weapon team is essentially a specialist unit that performs a limited role, and they generally aren't reliable or powerful enough to hinge most of your battle plan on. As a significant support role in a weapon team army, maybe, but you will still generally need to make sure your infantry blocks are tooled up enough to deal with combat, and still cover your other bases, e.g. magic.

Which links back to the original question: IMO there is no best weapon team. There are weapon teams that do more stuff than others, weapon teams that do more useful stuff, weapon teams that have better value for points in terms of effectiveness, applicability, average damage output, reliability etc... WFTs are definitely more preferable than ratlings, for example, while warpgrinders have a rather limited and unreliable role, which makes them inapplicable except for the most specific strategies. Comparing a doomflayer and a WFT would be apples and oranges, and PWMs work better in some strategies than in others, so it ultimately comes down to the flavour of your battle plan.
hannanibal
 
*Angry mob assembles*

"WHAT DO WE WANT!!??"
"A THINNISH, WATERY PAINT WITH A GREENER TINGE THAN AGRAX EARTHSHADE!!"
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Paricidas
Doomwheel Driver
Atropos
Dec 15 2010, 01:30 PM
For instance, if you're facing Elves, IMO the WFT should perform better. The template can hit a lot of them, ignoring their AS (speaking about infantry).

As long as your WFTs can not ignore the BS4 archers and the giant eagles, I think you are better off with the PWM which can at least get hard cover from some slaves.

But even that opinion is quite debatable.
Ceterum censeo Altdorfem esse delendam
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Atropos
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Any weapon team can be easily knocked... Even hidden PWMs with enemy's scouts and so on.
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Flem
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A blood curling cough a day, keeps the assassins away

Personally i try to have the right tool for the right job.
I always field at least one PWM, it's a fantastic weapon for high T or high As units like knights or chaos warriors. Plus it's a move or fire. There's not much more to wish for ;-).

A WFT is superb against low LD units because of the panic test, or against your average core troop with a 5+ AS. Unlike the PWM a WFT can damage standerd infrantry and knights, but also monsterous infantry because of the D3 wounds.On the downside it's a short range weapon, and it's move or fire.

The Doomflayer is by far my most favourite weapon to field. It's a cheaper weapon and has the potential to boost your combat abilities. even it's D3 strenght 4 impact hits cut down core like butter. It's misfire is also one of the best you can have.if it blows up and leaves a template behind you still ravege the unit you charged, and maybe a bit of your own rats but hey plenty where those came from right? IMO the biggest advantage is that i can combine it with my storm banner. A WFT, PWM or ratlingun can all be troubled and won't shoot. I don't like counting on my luck so taking the safest bet(aka the path that ruins the least of my own models ;-) )is the best path.

The ratling gun, i've tried it a couple of times but i'm not conviced. Compared to the more expensive weapon teams we can field, the ratling gun is the one that packs the most punch. With your average shot of rolling 2 die for hits you'll kill about 2-3 infrantry models. It's range is also rather short so i'd rather field a fire thrower for short range occasions.


So i agree with scrivener, there is no general best weapon team. Each weapon team has it's own use. So my advice is to field a combination of weapon teams.

Flem,
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Razuli
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Grey Seer
I always stand by my ratling gun, though not for main line carnage. I deploy mine with a unit of 10 SV in back (with the storm banner for the first turn) and together they guard my WLCs and PCCs, and I rarely have touble with flankers tying up/destroying my warmachines.
skavenmatt,Sep 11 2010
10:05 PM
Playing skaven to minimize randomness is like going to prom with your sister, you can do it if you really want, but in the end everyone will still laugh even if you do get lucky.


Clanlord Trask
18th April 2011 - 03:46 AM
I always take at least one Warpfire Thrower. You can't always rely on your opponent to do massive damage to your troops. Sometimes, you just have to do a job yourself.

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skavenmatt
Stormvermin
I love my warpfire throwers. templates, flaming attacks, panic tests, it's awesome. I've killed 16 black guard in one shot before, and it was beautiful. I agree w/ razuli on the rattling guns helping war machines out, they're great for pulping great eagles & other such warmachine hunters. I'm not impressed with the flayer or the mortar, though lots of people love mortars now. The grinder is the worst possible addition to the weapon teams catagory as it does extremely little damge, requires a unit of night runners (which suck now btw,) or gutter runners which have better deployment rules included in their purchase price. Awesome, I almost popped a unit of giant rats behind your line that cost more than twice as much, woo hoo. Just remember, no matter how many weapon teams you take, sometimes more slaves is just the way to go.
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Atropos
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skavenmatt
Dec 20 2010, 10:11 AM
Just remember, no matter how many weapon teams you take, sometimes more slaves is just the way to go.

So true I just had to quote that.
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Plague Priest Phebrickid
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'Embrace Pestilence!'
well, now i know that officially the best weapon team is the doom flayer!! :)

(see new skaven post page 5!)
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