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About Rat Ogres
Topic Started: 14th October 2010 - 11:15 PM (3,108 Views)
Nevamore
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Stormvermin
Rat ogres only really work well if allowed to hit the enemy at full strength and are supported by a RnF unit of your own. This makes it hard for them to be fully effective all the time. Lately I've been considering replacing them with PCBs (which I have never used, because since 8th came out they went from "cheesy as hell" to just a "good flanking unit"). Points wise, a unit of 6 ROs with 4 PMs comes in at 272. For the same points you can get 17 PCBs. The difference is 18 T4 wounds + 4 T3 wounds vs 17 T4 wounds, which are less susceptable to missile and artillery fire. Offensively, running the PCBs 6 wide you get 24 S5 attacks with HATRED, compared to 21 S5 attacks without. Against an average opponent, this is 18 hits from the PCBs while the ROs would only score 10. Then theres the gas aswell which is invaluable vs high armour targets.

The only real problem with PCBs I see is their cost. £8.50 for 2 means a dozens of them will set you back £51. They may not be as amazing as they were in 7th, but as far as flanking and building assault goes, I'd rather have these hard hitters than my rat ogres any day.

MUTATE: Ah yes, and if near a furnace they become LD8 and stubborn! Rat ogres tend to flee if not supported in prolonged combat.
When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.
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Ant


I like PCBs too (I think 13 is the ideal unit size incidentally). But I feel they have totally different roles to the ROs because of 1 thing: Flails.

ROs are S5 all the time. This means that they can grind stuff down and be in a prolonged combat. They just need to make sure they win all the time. I'd quite happily put a unit of ROs into a 30-40 strong enemy infantry unit (not chaos wariors etc, before that is mentioned), safe in the knowledge that I will consistently win combat, and although the enemy won't break for 2-3 turns, they will all die eventually. BUild the unit big enough and they might have a rank to get rid of steadfast earlier too.

The PCBs can't do this, because they go down to S3 and lose their hatred after the first round. They need to win in 1 round. This makes them useless against big steadfast blocks, but the perfect tools against smaller elite units that they can wipe out (as long as you have a large enough unit or are lucky enough to be fighting against a low I army).

So, despite both being heavy hitters with next to no ranks, both units are totally different.
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Kevlar
Doomwheel Driver
I think PCBs have a better purpose in 8th than flankers. 5 of them make great character assassins. You have a couple to absorb wounds, and three in the front will get 9 attacks on an enemy mage or bsb. Should be more than enough to take out a pesky enemy.

Granted this won't win you the points battle as 5 PCBs probably cost more than a hero or lower level mage, but it will allow you to dominate other phases as your opponent loses spells, leadership, and bsb rerolls.

Then again gutter runners are almost as good in close combat, and way better in the shooting phase!
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The Screaming Rat


One thing I really like to do with my rat orgres is have a warlord on a bonebreaker leading them... if you give the warlord the warlock agmented weapon he get +1 str and +1 attack... giving him 5 str 5 attacks to go with the bonebreakers 5 str 5 attacks! put that in a challenge... 10 str 5 attacks and the bonebreaker is t5!
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Sleboda
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Pensive Penguins Fan

I agree with Screaming Rat.

I take that bonebreaker with mine, often with the 2+ bouncing wound save. Send this unit at a block of basic dudes and watch them evaporate.

PCBs have totally left my lists.
True scholars have more than just one book to study.
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Stripsteak
Warlord
The Screaming Rat
Nov 9 2010, 10:15 AM
One thing I really like to do with my rat orgres is have a warlord on a bonebreaker leading them... if you give the warlord the warlock agmented weapon he get +1 str and +1 attack... giving him 5 str 5 attacks to go with the bonebreakers 5 str 5 attacks! put that in a challenge... 10 str 5 attacks and the bonebreaker is t5!

the bonebreakers t5 is pointless. its never used. You do however gain an extra wound on the warlord.
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the-graven
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Clan Moulder Mutator
You just have to use what you like, I love Clan Moulder(fluffwise and the converting possibilities) and I'm gonna make a themed list.
Also I have a unit of 5 ROgres+Bonebreaker Warlord and a unit of 4ROgres and an A-Bomb, shoot all that stupid HElves. Also 100 normal rats this is at 1500 points, might not be the most competitive but I like it and that's why I use it.

P.S. I'm trying for a refused flank.
I'm just like you, just sexier and smarter ^^
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reddogfish77
Grey Seer
i cant figure out how you work out things for warlord on BB.

if he gets 4 wounds from being mounted on it... what if the warlord dies... and can people target his mount...
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Daemon Sultan
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Clanrat
Having a huge horde of Skaven is good, but at some point, you need high strenght to break the enemy lines, this is where Ratogres come to their own.
Honestly not a Dalek.
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Krogholt
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Chieftain
Nevamore
Oct 15 2010, 09:01 AM
MUTATE: Ah yes, and if near a furnace they become LD8 and stubborn! Rat ogres tend to flee if not supported in prolonged combat.

As far as I recall you cannot use both of these modifiers at the same time? - either you are stubborn at Ld 5, or you may add the rank bonus of the PMs, but do not gain stubborn... I was quite sure I had read it in the faq, but I'm unable to find it now... So either its a rule in the book; it has been removed from the faq; or else I'm simply wrong :)
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Kevlar
Doomwheel Driver
Krogholt
Nov 12 2010, 06:55 AM
Nevamore
Oct 15 2010, 09:01 AM
MUTATE: Ah yes, and if near a furnace they become LD8 and stubborn! Rat ogres tend to flee if not supported in prolonged combat.

As far as I recall you cannot use both of these modifiers at the same time? - either you are stubborn at Ld 5, or you may add the rank bonus of the PMs, but do not gain stubborn... I was quite sure I had read it in the faq, but I'm unable to find it now... So either its a rule in the book; it has been removed from the faq; or else I'm simply wrong :)

That was the old 7th edition stubborn where you had to test on your base leadership. With the 8th edition FAQ we get SiN, at least for steadfast, which is just like stubborn.
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Krogholt
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Chieftain
Kevlar
Nov 12 2010, 07:59 AM
Krogholt
Nov 12 2010, 06:55 AM
Nevamore
Oct 15 2010, 09:01 AM
MUTATE: Ah yes, and if near a furnace they become LD8 and stubborn! Rat ogres tend to flee if not supported in prolonged combat.

As far as I recall you cannot use both of these modifiers at the same time? - either you are stubborn at Ld 5, or you may add the rank bonus of the PMs, but do not gain stubborn... I was quite sure I had read it in the faq, but I'm unable to find it now... So either its a rule in the book; it has been removed from the faq; or else I'm simply wrong :)

That was the old 7th edition stubborn where you had to test on your base leadership. With the 8th edition FAQ we get SiN, at least for steadfast, which is just like stubborn.

That. Is. AWESOME!
Too bad I really don't like the whole Pestilence theme, but I just need to find a way to Eshinify the PCBs. Anyway, thx for clarifying the above.
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Sleboda
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reddogfish77
Nov 12 2010, 01:25 AM
i cant figure out how you work out things for warlord on BB.

if he gets 4 wounds from being mounted on it... what if the warlord dies... and can people target his mount...

People cannot target the mount. In 8th there are new rules for characters riding things like eagles and bonebreakers. Use the highest wounds.
True scholars have more than just one book to study.
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spriten


I fielded a unit of 4 a this week, with two pack masters. Both packmasters (and one ogre) died to shooting , and the Rogres failed their frenzy test, and charged 20 Lothern Sea Guard in the front.
One died from their spears, but the two remaining beasts won me the combat! Those strength five attacks really love squishy elves ^_^
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Big AL
Chieftain
I use units of 2 with a single pack master as cheap(ish) support and more deployments that don't take up much room. They always surprise the hell out of me when I combo charge them into a unit with clanrats or even slaves.
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