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Any Tips against WoC?
Topic Started: 27th July 2010 - 05:42 PM (1,062 Views)
Paricidas
Doomwheel Driver
Tomorrow I am going to play my first 8th edition game in a new club. Does anybody already got some expierence with the "new" WoC and wants to share it?
Its gonna be a 1500 points game and I dont want my first army list to be extra cheesy so no great targets (perhaps a DW) and no seer for me.

Here some questions:
Are the plague-mortars worth their points against WoC?
Are Jezails still usefull against them?
Gutter runners still useless?
Should I take SV?
How many challenges can/must the WoC-Player issue per combat?
etc. etc. etc.
Ceterum censeo Altdorfem esse delendam
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Clanseer Skabrius
Lord of the Undermountain
I haven't played against WoC in 8th yet, but a trick that still works is abusing the fact that he has to challenge; you just move your guys to safety. There's no way you'll beat them in an even fight, so you'll want lots of units to outflank him. Feed his heavy hitters slaves while you use your manouvrability to break his ranks.

I wouldn't bother with Stormvermin, they'll still be slaughtered. Beware the nasty item combo that makes you miscast, it hurts even more in 8th. One Hell Pit Abomination might be nice to help your rank and file hordes a bit.
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Paricidas
Doomwheel Driver
Clanseer Skabrius
Jul 27 2010, 05:47 PM
I haven't played against WoC in 8th yet, but a trick that still works is abusing the fact that he has to challenge; you just move your guys to safety. There's no way you'll beat them in an even fight, so you'll want lots of units to outflank him. Feed his heavy hitters slaves while you use your manouvrability to break his ranks.

I wouldn't bother with Stormvermin, they'll still be slaughtered. Beware the nasty item combo that makes you miscast, it hurts even more in 8th. One Hell Pit Abomination might be nice to help your rank and file hordes a bit.

Well I could run a seer with the 13th, shoot the hell out of his generals unit and finish him and his budys with a power scroll, the rest of his army is scorched away or eaten by an A-Bomb, but I think seers and A-Bombs are a little too cheesy for 1500 points.

And I do think that an assassin would have a real chance to tear at least his heros a new one, 3 rerollable ASF attacks str7 D3 wounds are something even a chaos charakter has to respect, but if that guy has a 4+ ward, this will get risky (and expensive...).
Ceterum censeo Altdorfem esse delendam
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reddogfish77
Grey Seer
death frenzy the assassins unit.... just in case.
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icecoolio


If you play for more than 1500 pts, then I will tell you to play with 2 Hell Pit Abomination ............ but it's not really fun to play like this, one will be good enough.

The only things I know is beware the knight with Juggernaut unit...... too powerful to face with........ and very hard to kill.
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Trulseren
Clanrat
Clanseer Skabrius
Jul 27 2010, 12:47 PM
I haven't played against WoC in 8th yet, but a trick that still works is abusing the fact that he has to challenge; you just move your guys to safety.

Why do people think this? You don't move your guy to safety, the opposing player still chooses which model to move to the back (unless 8th ed changed this). What Verminious valour does is give you the opportunity to use that characters Ld. If your opponent is not a complete dunce he will move your champion to the back and use his RnF to kill your characters anyway.

I'd say tie him up with BIG units of slaves and keep shooting into combat. According to the faq you don't even randomise hits anymore against units that are in combat with slaves.
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Omens
Clanrat
Champs cant be moved to the back.
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reddogfish77
Grey Seer
wait can anyone confirm that you dont randomise shooting into combats...
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Charming
Clanrat
reddogfish77
Aug 2 2010, 10:25 AM
wait can anyone confirm that you dont randomise shooting into combats...

Look under slaves rules, and the latest FAQ. The errata tells you to remove the scentence that says that you randomize hits when you shoot on a target that's in combat, and nothing in the rulebook tells you how to randomize them. That boils down to no randomization (note that you still have to see the target you're shooting at, though).
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wolfmage68


Don't know if i'm missing something but the faq doesn't seem to say anything about randomising and the skaven shooting into combat entry specifically says roll to hit then roll the dice again and 1-3 hits a friendly unit and 4+ is an enemy unit.
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James100
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Chieftain
Paricidas
Jul 27 2010, 12:42 PM
Are the plague-mortars worth their points against WoC?

Umm it depends really. plague claws are good against high armoured low toughness troops but they might make there points back but i wouldn't take it. i have had bad experiance with wulfrik in the past. on the other hand poisioned wind mortars are brilliant. moving and firing aswell as ignoring armour saves.

be careful of chaos armies they have the ability to field elite good armoured troops (chaos warriors) and field cheap troops with I4 (marauders). they can field light calvary (marauder horsemen and warhounds) and Heavily armoured troops that most likely have a banner that gives them a 4+ ward against shooting (chaos knights). they can field monsturous infantry (trolls, ogres and dragon ogres) and field big monsters (Shaggoth, Dragon, Spawns and hellcannons which are formidable in combat).

Taylor your army to what he has or what you think he has.

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Omens
Clanrat
wolfmage68
Aug 2 2010, 09:14 PM
Don't know if i'm missing something but the faq doesn't seem to say anything about randomising and the skaven shooting into combat entry specifically says roll to hit then roll the dice again and 1-3 hits a friendly unit and 4+ is an enemy unit.

The FAQ says to remove this bit where it mentions randomising :)
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Pestilent Lord
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Doomwheel Driver
Paricidas
Jul 27 2010, 01:42 PM
Are the plague-mortars worth their points against WoC?

Plagueclaw Catapult, maybe. No-armor is always nice against Warriors, but it will mostly be wounding on 6s and the Auto-panic is less useful because they re-roll panic tests. Poison Wind Mortars, almost definitely, wounding on 5s with no armor isn't half bad and move-and-shoot is even better.

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Are Jezails still usefull against them?

Assuming he brings Warriors, Chosen, Knights or any of their various large targets? Yes. If he brings a Marauder horde-style list the Jezzails will have a harder time finding juicy enough targets to be worth it.

Quote:
 
Gutter runners still useless?

Still very little ranged combat in the army list, lone characters aren't terribly likely (and if present they will be LETHAL). Making matters worse, march blocking is now a leadership test away from useless. I wouldn't bother with them.

Quote:
 
Should I take SV?

Probably not. Properly equipped, their cheapest infantry blocks in the army list (Marauders) are more than a match for SV. Just go for sheer weight of numbers.

Quote:
 
How many challenges can/must the WoC-Player issue per combat?

If a model can issue a challenge, it must. Of course, only one challenge can occur in any given combat. So if he's got a champ, a sorcerer and an exalted hero all in a combat he'll have a choice of what to send. You'll then have a choice of who gets to die (send in the champion!). On the other hand, you could bring no champions and keep one character per unit, thereby insuring that when you decline he'll be sending your character back (hence why my warlocks units almost never have champs).
“A player is never late, Dave. Nor is he early. He arrives precisely when the plot dictates he should.”
Skaven 7th:
W/L/D
6/5/2
High Elves:
2/3/1
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Warlock Matik
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(Z–>)90º – (E–N²W)90ºt = 1

I'm not sure, but I know champs can't be moved if they decline so I think your opponent has to move the character that can, so it doesn't matter if you have a champ and warlock.

Actually, just checked and your opponent can't choose to retire champions anyway.
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Wargamejunkie
Warlord
@Matik- Do you have a Pg number on that? That could be something useful to know.

I played a game against them last week and got plastered.
His list
Lord on Steed
BSB on Steed
Lvl 1 on Steed w/ Death

3 X Khorne Knight Units
2 X Khorne Warrior Unit
1 X Khorne Marauder Unit
2 X Hell Cannons

I hope to play him again tonight. I plan to make a couple changes to the list so lets see if they work.
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