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Interested in Skaven; Looking for some advice
Topic Started: 2nd January 2010 - 05:05 AM (1,012 Views)
Nevamore
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Stormvermin
CurseoftheHornedSheep
Jan 2 2010, 04:03 PM
2) A good Furnace unit is going to be around 600 points... 30 Plague Monks, the furnace, a Lvl 2 Plague Priest loaded up with stuff, full command, and a Plague Banner (the Plague Banner is a MUST for Plague Monks; I take it with just about every Plague Monk unit I use). So while taking the Furnace in a 1,000 point game isn't suggested by me, I will say that you can fit it into a 1,500 point game along with a Doomwheel (I tried a HPA, they cried "cheese"  :( ). And that thing is a monster in close combat.

The plague banner is a magic item, so is restricted to "one per army".
When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.
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CurseoftheHornedSheep
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Chieftain
Nevamore
Jan 2 2010, 12:50 PM
CurseoftheHornedSheep
Jan 2 2010, 04:03 PM

2) A good Furnace unit is going to be around 600 points... 30 Plague Monks, the furnace, a Lvl 2 Plague Priest loaded up with stuff, full command, and a Plague Banner (the Plague Banner is a MUST for Plague Monks; I take it with just about every Plague Monk unit I use). So while taking the Furnace in a 1,000 point game isn't suggested by me, I will say that you can fit it into a 1,500 point game along with a Doomwheel (I tried a HPA, they cried "cheese"  :( ). And that thing is a monster in close combat.

The plague banner is a magic item, so is restricted to "one per army".


My bad--I didn't clarify; "just about every plague monk unit I use" actually means "I give the Plague Banner to a plague monk unit in just about every game".
Despite all my rage, I am still just a rat in a cage...

THIRTEENTH SPELL CASTS: 13 KILLS: 72 Empire Swordsmen, 12 Greatswords, 1 Warrior Priest, 2 Captains of the Empire, 1 Whatever the Empire's lord-level mage is called, 36 Dwarf Hammerers, 2 Thanes, 1 Dwarf Lord on Shieldbearers, 1 Dwarf Lord, 19 Saurus Temple Guard, 14 Chaos Chosen, 12 Glade Guard

Fellblade Kills: 3 Dwarven war machines, 1 Dwarf Runelord, 1 Dark Elf Hyrdra, 1 High Elf Sun Dragon, 1 High Elf Dragon Mage
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RatOnFire
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Chieftain
stormvermin pushing the bell is pretty strong, but expensive. Even in sixth, when the vermin were more points, I found them to have pretty good staying power. All in all I'd consider them a good unit for pinning things, since they can usually hold a charge without having to actually kill anything.

I find Rat ogres to be just plain cool. They need their master moulder though. I wouldn't take more than four RO in the same unit (they get unwieldly).

both myself and another skaven player I know have used the PW mortar, and it's temperamental on the scatter. It's still fun for being move AND fire though.

As to the furnace, just keep it's flanks protected, and it should be very killy. Oh, and watch out for flyers and fast cave, since they can throw it out of position due to frenzy.
As it turns out, no, I don't love the smell of warpfire in the morning.
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Joasht
Clanrat
I read the 7th Ed tactica against "everything" on this forum, and I noticed something; almost the entire battle seems to be dictated purely on you trying your best to protect your flank while trying to flank your opponent. While its typically the concern of all races, it seems that Skaven live/die by it.

Does this make the Skaven very difficult to play?
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scrivener
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*toot*

Joasht
Jan 3 2010, 02:08 PM
I read the 7th Ed tactica against "everything" on this forum, and I noticed something; almost the entire battle seems to be dictated purely on you trying your best to protect your flank while trying to flank your opponent. While its typically the concern of all races, it seems that Skaven live/die by it.

Does this make the Skaven very difficult to play?

Not particularly, considering we usually pack enough units that we can cover our flanks most of the time (or can sacrifice a few units, if necessary). The main reason why flanks are so important to us is mainly to do with the importance of Strength in Numbers boosting our otherwise poor Ld, and this gets neutralised by flank and rear charges. However, I think our flank issue isn't as fragile in 7th edition than it was in 6th edition, considering we now have access to unbreakable.
hannanibal
 
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Joasht
Clanrat
Ah alright, I was a tad concerned that Skaven were one of those "crack-your-head-to-play" races ....... I like to enjoy my games, not spend every moment overanalyzing the situation :P
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mrtn
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Swashbuckler
CurseoftheHornedSheep
Jan 2 2010, 11:03 PM
I'd definitely pay 10 points more for the much for devastating (albeit less safe) Warpfire Thrower. With no partials with the flame template, automatic S5 hits that get an additional -2 to armor saves, flaming attacks, and the whole 1+ kill(s) = panic thing, they seem like the obvious (and popular) choice.

The -2 to armour save isn't in addition to the S5, it's because of the S5. Otherwise the jezzails would get -7 to the armour save...
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CurseoftheHornedSheep
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Chieftain
mrtn
Jan 3 2010, 11:06 AM
CurseoftheHornedSheep
Jan 2 2010, 11:03 PM
I'd definitely pay 10 points more for the much for devastating (albeit less safe) Warpfire Thrower.  With no partials with the flame template, automatic S5 hits that get an additional -2 to armor saves, flaming attacks, and the whole 1+ kill(s) = panic thing, they seem like the obvious (and popular) choice.

The -2 to armour save isn't in addition to the S5, it's because of the S5. Otherwise the jezzails would get -7 to the armour save...

CurseoftheHornedSheep
Jan 2 2010, 11:03 PM
I'd definitely pay 10 points more for the much for devastating (albeit less safe) Warpfire Thrower.  With no partials with the flame template, automatic S5 hits that get an additional -2 to armor saves, flaming attacks, and the whole 1+ kill(s) = panic thing, they seem like the obvious (and popular) choice.


^Thought that because the Ratling and the Doomflayer was S4 with a -2 to armor and Jezzail was S6 with -4... wasn't ever sure if the "save" was the overall or the basic without the S>3 modifiers.

So to clarify, the Ratling, Doomflayer, and Jezzail both get an additional -1 to the enemy armor save on top of the strength modifier?
Despite all my rage, I am still just a rat in a cage...

THIRTEENTH SPELL CASTS: 13 KILLS: 72 Empire Swordsmen, 12 Greatswords, 1 Warrior Priest, 2 Captains of the Empire, 1 Whatever the Empire's lord-level mage is called, 36 Dwarf Hammerers, 2 Thanes, 1 Dwarf Lord on Shieldbearers, 1 Dwarf Lord, 19 Saurus Temple Guard, 14 Chaos Chosen, 12 Glade Guard

Fellblade Kills: 3 Dwarven war machines, 1 Dwarf Runelord, 1 Dark Elf Hyrdra, 1 High Elf Sun Dragon, 1 High Elf Dragon Mage
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Nevamore
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Stormvermin
CurseoftheHornedSheep
Jan 3 2010, 12:18 PM
So to clarify, the Ratling, Doomflayer, and Jezzail both get an additional -1 to the enemy armor save on top of the strength modifier?

Yup, they're (effectively/actually) armour piercing weapons.
When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro.
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throtstillsux:(
Stormvermin
errmk my turn.

Rat ogres can dish out a lot of pain (I'm used to them in 6thed) They can actually be used in games where winning is your primary goal. They're champion is a good buy aswell. Put them on the flank and don't run you army around them in any way

They've covered the stormvermin quite appropiately.

Bell/furnace is a good choice, however, huge model, very expensive (dollars i mean) and I dont believe in unbreakable skaven

I find the doomflayer to be the best weapon team, it's like adding a good character to the combat effectiveness of a unit. That being said WFT can be absolutely digusting and ratlings have occasional "omg Im so glad i have that" moments; in my eyes, is best to mix bugger up, I bring all three. (Yes I'm ignoring the mortars, they can also be good, though they rely on getting a hit on the scatter like a lot of weapons.)

Skaven magic is very powerful, i advise casting a lot and casting often, bring wizzers!

Hmm cant remember what else was asked about.
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Joasht
Clanrat
i'm about one step away from deciding to get a battleforce and maybe some other items, but i have one last question before i submit my order; are the skaven fun to play. And what do you enjoy most about them?

Thanks!
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reddogfish77
Grey Seer
they are more fun than anyother army... so many times have my ratling gunsd spun around and wiped out one of my own units... and so many times have i cast plague into a combat with heaps of my own troops... just to kill a few of theirs... of course sometimes you dont want the bad things to happen like in tournies... but usually you take the good with the bad.
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Nordic
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Warlord
if its not too late already, perhaps you should test play a few games with them before you order them? either by lending someones skaven army or by proxing.
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Joasht
Clanrat
The only people that I play Fantasy with (and, in fact, the only people here that I know play fantasy) are my cousin and a few of my friends, none of them play skaven XD
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Joasht
Clanrat
So I gave in and purchased a Battalion and an extra box of Clanrats and made an army list here:
http://underempire.net/index.php?showtopic...0&#entry2976482

I figured my next purchased would be another Battalion (to bring myself up to 50 Clanrats and 50 Slaves, 30 Monks, ~10 Censer Bearers and a ton of giant rats) followed by a Plague Furnace. I'll also have to convert something for an Abomination in the mean time, and maybe two boxes of Stormvermin.

I will face O&G (or HE) and DE a lot, as my cousin and good friend play those races. Any advice against them?

Thanks!
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