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| New skaven player vermin lord question | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: 2nd January 2010 - 12:41 AM (1,639 Views) | |
| warhammerfinn | 2nd January 2010 - 12:41 AM Post #1 |
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Hey guys, I'm a long time warhammer player, but new to skaven. I've started building an army with a batallion box and some slaves that I have. I plan to run a vermin lord because they're just plain cool. I have two questions first though. The first question is fluff wise, what would one expect to find in a vermin lord led army. I'm going to fill out the basics, but I'm looking for further purchases after the basic slaves, clan rats, etc.. The second question is what sort of choices would be good in a moderately competitive or a fairly competitive environment (I play in two different cities). Thanks for any help in advance. |
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| throtstillsux:( | 2nd January 2010 - 01:35 AM Post #2 |
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Stormvermin
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Well in terms of fluff, a mixed army (all clans) would make the most sense as a verminlord would be leading a very large, very important army which would be noticeable enough to garner all the major clan's participation. An all or mostly pestilense list would also make sense as they are religious fanatics. Ideally you would play 3000 pts and also have a grey seer, the individual who would have summoned and be trying to make use of verminlord. In terms of being competitive I have a hard time helping... I've never tried a Vlord, and generally I lack good sense about what is very powerful and what is actually just a point sink. I would advise taking the storm banner, activate it early because you Vlord will only need two turns (maybe less!) to get into combat, also, take a unit of tunnellers of some sort to take out these dangerous warmachines (cannons for the most part) out of the way for later. Basically, guard him from ranged and only charge rank and file with a unit of your own rank and file, you don't have to flank or anything fancy, you just need to match their static five with your own, then your Vlord can rack up kills. Certainly thow him at expensive characters. unfortunately, Vlords cast worst than grey seer's for twice the cost, so your army will be weaker on magic when compared to the army's potential, so perhaps take your other characters as wizards of the lvl two variety. The Vlord points your army towards a hard-hitting, low model strat, so I suggest building on that with one or two hell pit aboms and other power melee options such as the plague furnace as you already should have the anti-ranged to protect your Vlord. I guess all in all plague priests will be your friend as they work from a fluffy/competetive/fix weakness (magic)perspective. |
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| Theskit Neek | 2nd January 2010 - 01:36 AM Post #3 |
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Clanrat
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All I can say is a grey seer or warlord would be handy since the Vermin Lord can't be the army general. The plague furnace has got a lot of people scared, its a good purchase. It is unbreakable and the unit that is pushing it becomes unbreakable too. Except for that Ill leave you in the capable hands of the senior people here. |
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Neek! Warlord Thraskitar Squelch'es current campaign trophy rack: 2 wraiths & a banshee, 5 tombguard, 3 Marauders, 5 Chaos Warriors. It's not worth doing something unless you were doing something that someone, somewere, would much rather you weren't doing.
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| Bibamus | 2nd January 2010 - 01:37 AM Post #4 |
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Grey Seer
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regarding the competitive part: not the verminlord... he is a 500 point giveaway to your opponent... you basically start the game with a 500 VP difference. he is just crap, but nobody will stop you from using one. fluffwise: he is basically a big rat demon, set by the great horned one himself... i doubt that there is any rat that would say no when a verminlord calls out for war so anything goes really, any number of warlord clans and all 4 great ones. mutate: seriously? i've been ninjaed by 2 people?! mutate 2: i thought he could be the general, mea culpa |
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It would be ugly to watch people poking sticks at a caged rat. It is uglier still to watch rats poking sticks at a caged person. 13th spell casts: 2 Kills: 32 Grave Guard,1 Vampire Lord | |
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| throtstillsux:( | 2nd January 2010 - 01:42 AM Post #5 |
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Stormvermin
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Wait, so can he be the general or not? |
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| I_ated_Warpstone | 2nd January 2010 - 02:10 AM Post #6 |
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Grey Seer
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He cannot be the general. Also, Throt, why do you say the Vermin Lord isn't as good a caster as a Grey Seer. They are both level 4. |
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Skaven Tournament Performances Battle for the Block - Best General 4th Quarter RT - Best Overall Rumble in Jackson - Best Overall Toys for Tots Charity Tourney - Best General 1st Quarter RT - Best Overall Gamerz Depot Tourney - 1st Place "Hassle, annoy, aggravate, whatever it takes to not engage in a fair fight" Tournament players are people too | |
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| Theskit Neek | 2nd January 2010 - 02:29 AM Post #7 |
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Clanrat
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@WarhammerFinn: He can't be the army general, it's in his special rules.
@throtstillsux:( & I_ated_Warpstone: I'm curious too about that grey seer/vermin lord thing too. I don't think the D3 warpstone tokens extra that he gets are going to make it.
Hahaha, I already had that reaction to the guy who was before me. This is awesome. |
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Neek! Warlord Thraskitar Squelch'es current campaign trophy rack: 2 wraiths & a banshee, 5 tombguard, 3 Marauders, 5 Chaos Warriors. It's not worth doing something unless you were doing something that someone, somewere, would much rather you weren't doing.
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| warhammerfinn | 2nd January 2010 - 03:29 AM Post #8 |
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Thanks guys. I knew he couldn't be the actual general, but I figure that if he's there he's leading things regardless of who helps with leadership tests... . The big lure for me is the ability to use a big, tough monster that no one will whine about because of the toughness 5, no armour, no general deal. I figure that he wouldn't be too[/I] competitive. I hate having a painted bloodthirster and lord of change that took a lot of time and money that now sit on the shelf over ninety percent of the time (only super competitive venues obviously). Would a mixed army with a plague priest general, some plague monks, some clan rats, slaves, and a few ninjas sound reasonable fluffwise? Maybe with an abomination and plague furnace to throw in for competitive games. |
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| Hobbit | 2nd January 2010 - 09:08 AM Post #9 |
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Clanrat
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I have also a question: Is Verminlord a character (so you can chellange him) since his rules says that he is a monster? |
| Skaven Magic Cards Project | |
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| Bibamus | 2nd January 2010 - 09:39 AM Post #10 |
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Grey Seer
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the only things that make him a character are his entry in teh army list (lords and heroes section and teh fac that he uses a lord choice) and his fluff. he can't join units to lead them, he can't be the general and he can't hav eany magic items.... i guess he is a character since that makes the most sense but he might just aswell be a monster. it probably says its a monster so we know what kind of rules to use for arc of sight and charging |
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It would be ugly to watch people poking sticks at a caged rat. It is uglier still to watch rats poking sticks at a caged person. 13th spell casts: 2 Kills: 32 Grave Guard,1 Vampire Lord | |
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| Nevamore | 2nd January 2010 - 03:19 PM Post #11 |
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Stormvermin
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Yup, hes a character-monster in the same sense that the troll king and kolek are characters but also monsters in the WoC book. |
| When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro. | |
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| Ratarsed | 2nd January 2010 - 06:09 PM Post #12 |
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Grey Seer
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Cant default to skitterleap and cannot be skitterlept maybe? Makes Crackscall and poison wind a lot more powerful if you can skitterleap into the perfect spot first. What I want to know is why he is a large target? Anyone stood him next to a Carnosaur lately <_< Ratarsed |
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| SiliconSicilian | 2nd January 2010 - 07:46 PM Post #13 |
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Grey Seer
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Not that my interpretation here is correct, but the book is somewhat loosely written. However, the size comparison between a Carnosaur and a Saurus is less than a VLord and a Clanrat. I don't think it should be considered a large target but that is what we are stuck with. Perhaps a newer, adequately sized, model is needed. |
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| Bibamus | 2nd January 2010 - 08:00 PM Post #14 |
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Grey Seer
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alltough "technically" he can exchange a spell for skitterleap (1st spell in a lore-BRB, skaven army book does not contradict this) he can't use it on himself... it needs to be a single model with US1 while the VL being a moster has US=W |
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It would be ugly to watch people poking sticks at a caged rat. It is uglier still to watch rats poking sticks at a caged person. 13th spell casts: 2 Kills: 32 Grave Guard,1 Vampire Lord | |
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| Nevamore | 2nd January 2010 - 11:14 PM Post #15 |
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Stormvermin
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As for the comment about the VL being an inferior spell caster to the Grey Seer, I believe that the opposite is true when it comes to the lore of plague. Most spells in that lore are short ranged, and seeing as the best place to have him is right up in the enemy's face, this is a good thing. As for the general consensus of the VL being a poor lord choice, I think he's a little better than most people give him credit for. Not all armies you face have a load of shooting or magic, and although I'd rather use my points on a seer in 2k point games, I would definitely consider one in 3k+ games. |
| When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro. | |
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. The big lure for me is the ability to use a big, tough monster that no one will whine about because of the toughness 5, no armour, no general deal. I figure that he wouldn't be too[/I] competitive. I hate having a painted bloodthirster and lord of change that took a lot of time and money that now sit on the shelf over ninety percent of the time (only super competitive venues obviously). 