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The Doomwheel; -Is it broken?
Topic Started: 6th December 2009 - 10:28 AM (2,333 Views)
FatherSquee
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Holder of Clan Pestilens "Most Sexiest" Award

I have horrible luck with mine (I think it'll continue being pissed off until I finish painting it :D ) but more often than not I end up flubbing the roll and it 'splodes itself. When it does work though man it's awesome! But it definitely has it's weaknesses. Especially when it stops half an inch from the enemy line :blink:

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the doomwheel will get eaten alive by a hero in CC

Last game my Beastman opponent went first, he moved up full distance, cast bears anger and steed of shadows then hammered right into my Doomwheel; damn thing didn't stand a chance :(
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Ratarsed
Grey Seer
I_ated_Warpstone
Dec 6 2009, 04:00 PM
6 x 4 table should give you plenty of room to one flank or another to have an 18.5" gap. I play with 6 blocks of Infantry + 8 Jezzails + 7 Skirmishers + a HPA and I've never not had room to place it on the outs and then have it roll in shortly thereafter.

I did exactly that with my doomwheel in my game against the Dwarfs. Army one side, doomwheel the other. Misfired, went out of control and ran into a building destroying itself. Either I've been increadibly unlucky or you for 30 games in a row have been lucky :huh:

There are so many ways the Doomwheel can fail to perform that I think you must be getting good fortune or playing inexperienced players

Have you never had the Doomwheel charged by a Lord on Dragon turn 2?
Never had anyone flee a Doomwheel charge then counter charge with a ranked up unit?
Never rolled really low for distance allowing the wheel to be charged by a full ranked unit?
Never been hit by a Empire great cannon destroying it in one shot before it even gets into combat?

The list could go on.

Ratarsed
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I_ated_Warpstone
Grey Seer
Ratarsed
Dec 6 2009, 04:52 PM
I did exactly that with my doomwheel in my game against the Dwarfs. Army one side, doomwheel the other. Misfired, went out of control and ran into a building destroying itself. Either I've been increadibly unlucky or you for 30 games in a row have been lucky :huh:



Have you never had the Doomwheel charged by a Lord on Dragon turn 2?
Never had anyone flee a Doomwheel charge then counter charge with a ranked up unit?
Never rolled really low for distance allowing the wheel to be charged by a full ranked unit?
Never been hit by a Empire great cannon destroying it in one shot before it even gets into combat?

The list could go on.

Ratarsed

Solid play negates those things.

A lord on a dragon has many other threats in my army - assuming he isn't walking as I do play with 12 power dice and all my spells are in lore of Ruin. Even if he does want to charge me he'll have to withstand atleast one round of Zzzaps! and normally that will kill him.

Who drives the doomwheel at the front of their opponent's army and then cries about losing to static res? The Doomwheel is a flanking device. It rumbles up a flank, turns the corner and starts wolloping units from the flank. When I press my advantage with a Hell Pit on one flank and a Wheel on the other with 6 block infantry units pressing the middle my opponent's are a little hard pressed to worry about just the Doomwheel.

And a great cannon? Eh? I normally hide behind some piece of terrain and then shoot a magic missile in to the crew and make the cannon go away. Or I just ring the bell one good time and laugh.

I'll agree that if you don't understand how to use the Doomwheel it isn't so bad. But a properly used Doomwheel, in an appropriate army is a monster. It dismantles the creatures that are good at killing it and is too fast to get bogged down by standard CR troopers.

The Doomwheel, when put in the hands of a general who understands that it is a random piece and then goes about working on a battle plan to have it cause chaos and then be poised to reap the benefits of that chaos demonstrates that the Doomwheel is in fact an undercosted unit.

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There are so many ways the Doomwheel can fail to perform that I think you must be getting good fortune or playing inexperienced players


:lol: Inexperienced players - hohoho! My meta is composed of 12 players of that we have: the 08 ard boyz winner, 4 ard boyz runner ups, 7 GD Fantasy Tourney Winners, 7 Indy GT Winners, and honestly the list could go on. I do hate to brag (Ok I don't, I'm very proud of my meta's record) but yeah. I regularly play against: Double Hydra Dragon DE, BT Herald 12 Flamer Demons, Infernal Gateway Spam WoC, Double Dragon HE, Combat Res Spam HE, Unbreakable BG DE, VC Bunker, VC Ethereal Terror Bomb, Dual Stank Empire, EotG Spam Lizards, and pretty much every other tourney archtype that has won tournaments in the past 3 years.

Also, my Doomwheel rarely rolls above average for moment (11") and normally generates S4 and 6 hits for Zzaap! and I normally generate 7 attacks from my wheel rats, and most often do 4 charging impact hits and 2 non charging impact hit. I roll almost perfect averages with my Doomwheel and still have managed to have it perform exceedingly well.

So I don't think my success can be chalked up to good fortune or poor competition.
Skaven Tournament Performances
Battle for the Block - Best General
4th Quarter RT - Best Overall
Rumble in Jackson - Best Overall
Toys for Tots Charity Tourney - Best General
1st Quarter RT - Best Overall
Gamerz Depot Tourney - 1st Place

"Hassle, annoy, aggravate, whatever it takes to not engage in a fair fight"
Tournament players are people too
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Ratarsed
Grey Seer
I_ated_Warpstone
Dec 6 2009, 05:11 PM
So I don't think my success can be chalked up to good fortune or poor competition.

I think your 30 out of 30 success must have a good deal of fortune. To never have a bad misfire, to always have the terrain in the right spot to hide behind, to never fluff your attacks. Being able to roll averages all the time is quite remarkable good fortune IMO.
Me on the other hand 2nd time out and the stupid thing runs into a house turn 2 and destroys itself. Perhaps I'm just unlucky.

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carcharoth
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Slayer of Lizardmen
the doomwheel is the only thing in our list i consider underpriced. IMO, 150 points for the DW is not far from hydra-level brokenness.

i always find it amusing that people who claim the HPA is pure cheese (which it isnt; not overpwered at all) are perfectly fine with the doomwheel, which is 100 points less and not that far from the abom in damage capacity and durability. doomwheel is our broken rare, not the HPA.
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UnderTheEarth
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Grey Seer Scabrac
My opinion

Hpa=Incredibly overpowered with! reactivatable stormbanner, but is perfectly fine for me without it...

on a side note, I was talking to a employee at my gw today, and they say that they've already been contacted by the faq crew, who stated that the stormbanner was supposed to be one use only and will be fixed in faq-not sure how reliable this is but...

doomwheel-Scary as hell against my steggies and stuff, and for somereason its better then a stegadon for less (stat wise)....... just like the damned hydra :(
However, it is very unpredictable + can misfire....Id expect it to be around 175 atleast though, then again, ive only played one game against them and I killed them fairly quickly....though it cost me an arm and a leg of temple guard and my beautiful engine skink priest
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I_ated_Warpstone
Grey Seer
UnderTheEarth
Dec 6 2009, 08:19 PM
on a side note, I was talking to a employee at my gw today, and they say that they've already been contacted by the faq crew,...


Just like to point out that whoever told you this is a liar. I worked for GW for 3 years and stores are never contacted by a "FAQ Crew". That's a store member trying to lend credit to his personal interpretation.
Skaven Tournament Performances
Battle for the Block - Best General
4th Quarter RT - Best Overall
Rumble in Jackson - Best Overall
Toys for Tots Charity Tourney - Best General
1st Quarter RT - Best Overall
Gamerz Depot Tourney - 1st Place

"Hassle, annoy, aggravate, whatever it takes to not engage in a fair fight"
Tournament players are people too
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UnderTheEarth
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Grey Seer Scabrac
good, although I know from personal experience already that they dont know anything at all...

skaven, they wont be coming out next! Verminlord? Never heard of such a thing :P

Then again, they were right once.....
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Bibamus
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Grey Seer
UnderTheEarth
Dec 6 2009, 08:25 PM
Then again, they were right once.....

about the verminlord from a gaming table's point of view? :P
It would be ugly to watch people poking sticks at a caged rat. It is uglier still to watch rats poking sticks at a caged person.


13th spell casts: 2 Kills: 32 Grave Guard,1 Vampire Lord
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outbreak
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Warlord
All luck with chariots. My tomb kings army has a unit of chariots with my prince's magical chariot doing d6+1 impact hits. I've had games where it rolls well multiple times and just rolls through flanks. I also had a game vs high elves where i rolled 14 impact hits (the unit has 3 chariots and the princes), rolled 7-8 wounds, he saved all the wounds with his armour save (was like 6+) and a 5+ (i think) ward save....
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Tenoshii
Warlord
UnderTheEarth
Dec 6 2009, 08:19 PM

on a side note, I was talking to a employee at my gw today, and they say that they've already been contacted by the faq crew, who stated that the stormdaemon was supposed to be one use only and will be fixed in faq-not sure how reliable this is but...

Why would Storm Daemon be one use only? Only Ikit can use it, he costs a lot of points, a lord slot and is only a level 3 wizard with some sub-par combat skills.

Ther only thing that makes him worth taking is Storm Daemon, which effectively makes him a level 4 wizard. It's even capable of misfiring and doing some fairly serious damage to his unit.

If Storm Daemon is one-use only, I'd be *very* surprised.

On-topic, the Doomwheel is way under-costed, definitely equal to the Hydra in terms of price-to-power.
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UnderTheEarth
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Grey Seer Scabrac
bah woops! I meant stormbanner lol....thats what I get for typing when im tired :P
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Tenoshii
Warlord
UnderTheEarth
Dec 7 2009, 07:35 AM
bah woops! I meant stormbanner lol....thats what I get for typing when im tired :P

And that's what I get for not taking a few seconds to realise what you actually meant :P

My reading comprehension FTL!
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Rakashani
Warlord
By "FAQ crew" he probably means Direwolf Council (who is not affiliated with GW in any way) but does the "live down the street from them" thing. DW is assembling the list of questions for the FAQ and they have already put that on the list and GW employees have already responded through unofficial channels that One Use Only will be errata'd into the English version as was intended. They've made no bones about posting that in many fora.

Now, whether or not you trust the DW group or not is up to you and whether or not you want to play in light of a pending FAQ is also up to you. I'm not proposing anything of the sort. Belittling someone for what is reported third hand about what they said is like playing a game of telephone and then blaming a participant for an error in translation somewhere along the way.
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Chieftain Cazgar
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Prophet of Plastic
maybe S7 wounds destroying chariots is something that'll be taken out in the next edition of warhammer, like partials from template attacks?

i've had 4 games with it now and it tends to do ok for me. i like it at 150 points.

thing is guys, it's a rare choice. if you paid 150 points on a rare unit and all it ever killed on the battle field was 150 points worth of enemys before dieing then it'd be pretty unspectacular. i mean, a unit of 25 clanrats might receive a charge from something hard on the opponents side and be wiped out without doing any damage at all. does that make clanrats overcosted?

if everything always took out exactly how many points it cost then all games would be draws.

and @I_ated_Warpstone: in a few threads now where you've voiced your opinion you do it in such a brash way. i mean, seriously, you've played against opponents that had cannons and the like and could NEVER target your doomwheel? or those bloodthirsters were NEVER able to charge you? how much terrain do you play with? cause you can't hide the wheel behind units. i'm sure they must be FANTASTIC players all of them if not ONCE they managed to do anything to your doomwheel at all, especially as you only ever roll poor to averagely with it :rolleyes:
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