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Banshee scream/casket of souls vs Strength in Nos.
Topic Started: 16th April 2008 - 02:05 AM (337 Views)
Squeek Squeek the battlehungry
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Chieftain
I've recently been playing tomb kings recently and soon will face banshee's . I was told that the casket of souls/Banshees uses the base leadership(meaning slaves are 2 and clanrats 5). Is this true that we don't get our strength in numbers for these tests? My local GW employee reinforced this saying that more numbers don't stop your soul from being ripped out. This seems counterintuitive to me though for a couple of reasons. These test are based of courage, and as such high leadership troops take many fewer casualties. Skaven are cowards by nature, and our low leadership reflects this. But when skaven mass in great numbers their courage increases tenfold. If anyone knows the answer to this it would be a big help since im the only skaven player in my area.
Huge Skaven Army for sale. I have built and primed over 4000pts worth of skaven, and have 2500pts of that painted and based. PM me for details if your interested.
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scrivener
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*toot*

Sounds like your GW employee is Delmont from warseer, or at least listens to him. Delmont used that exact same silly excuse.

This is from the time of the previous edition of Vamps, but the rule should still apply as no visible change has been made to negate it.

http://us.games-workshop.com/games/warhammer/skaven/extras/alessio-interview/alessioquestions3.htm
 
How does "Strength in Numbers" work vs. the Banshee's Howl from the Vampire Counts Army book? The howl isn't technically a "test" and so the Ld bonus from ranks shouldn't apply according to a strict reading of the rules. Clarification?

Alessio
For simplicity's sake I'd say that the Banshee Howl does indeed force a Ld-based test, so the Ld bonus should apply.


Note also that the new book's banshee's howl has a sentence expressly stating that modifiers such as general's Ld can be used. As SiN has the same application as general's Ld and is used in situations where general's Ld applies, then if general's Ld is allowed, so is SiN.

If anyone tells you otherwise and resorts to splitting hairs over the definition of "leadership test" or "leadership-based test", tell them that Alessio has officially called the ghostly howl a Ld-based test, then slap them with a trout.
hannanibal
 
*Angry mob assembles*

"WHAT DO WE WANT!!??"
"A THINNISH, WATERY PAINT WITH A GREENER TINGE THAN AGRAX EARTHSHADE!!"
"WHEN DO WE WANT IT!?"
"QUITE SOON PLEASE AS MY LAST POT IS RUNNING OUT!"
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Squeek Squeek the battlehungry
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Chieftain
is Alessio one of the main rule writers??? I'm not familiar with the name, but then again im not familiar with any of the authors of warhammer.
Huge Skaven Army for sale. I have built and primed over 4000pts worth of skaven, and have 2500pts of that painted and based. PM me for details if your interested.
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plague priest13
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Chieftain
he is the writer of the current skaven book...
and yes, has also writen many of the other books...

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scrivener
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*toot*

Alessio Cavatore also wrote the previous vamp army book IIRC, hence he's the best person to know about rules on vampire counts and skaven, and would definitely know what he's talking about in that quote. Gav Thorpe might have been the one who wrote the new vamp book, but I'm not aware of any change to the new book's banshee howl that would negate that quote's relevance.
hannanibal
 
*Angry mob assembles*

"WHAT DO WE WANT!!??"
"A THINNISH, WATERY PAINT WITH A GREENER TINGE THAN AGRAX EARTHSHADE!!"
"WHEN DO WE WANT IT!?"
"QUITE SOON PLEASE AS MY LAST POT IS RUNNING OUT!"
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Squeek Squeek the battlehungry
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Chieftain
thats great to know about the banshee then since I'll be playing a VC army this next tuesday :D. Does this same logic apply to the casket of souls as well?
Huge Skaven Army for sale. I have built and primed over 4000pts worth of skaven, and have 2500pts of that painted and based. PM me for details if your interested.
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Niz'tizi'ihack
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Mad Harbringer of Mutation
Isn't Alessio also the writer of 7th Ed Fantasy? I pretty sure he was.
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scrivener
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*toot*

Casket of Souls follows the same style as the Banshee's Howl, so if it's a Ld-based test for the banshee, it is for the casket as well. Alessio's principle is that to keep things simple, if it calculates against Ld, it's a Ld-based test. And if they tell you that the Casket is different because it doesn't have the sentence about allowing Ld modifiers which the banshee's howl has, tell them that it has been covered in the official GW errata:

Quote:
 
Q. Can you use the general's Ld (if in 12" range) when determining the number of wounds from the Casket?
A. Yes. For all purposes, a unit's Ld is equal to the general's if he's in 12" range.

So if you can use the general's Ld, you can use SiN.


And don't forget the trout. [size0]Aw, I could only get my hands on a can of sardines in oil. Will do though ~Morgoth :P
hannanibal
 
*Angry mob assembles*

"WHAT DO WE WANT!!??"
"A THINNISH, WATERY PAINT WITH A GREENER TINGE THAN AGRAX EARTHSHADE!!"
"WHEN DO WE WANT IT!?"
"QUITE SOON PLEASE AS MY LAST POT IS RUNNING OUT!"
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WageMage
Chieftain
Scrivener is indeed correct in his reasoning.
I don't understand why these rumours still circulate after all these time.

If some rule sounds too good to be true, it usually is ^_^
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Sammy the Squid
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Back to retirement!

Yeh, it still seems to be going around alot that people say SiN doesnt work against the Casket... I've had people say that although it works in the same manner as the Banshees scream, it isn't an actual Banshees scream so therefore the bonus shouldn't apply. Ofcourse this just over complicates things and sounds very flawed, but people still say it... And last time I saw a discussion about it on here (if I recall correctly) people were split on if it applies... Needless to say I'm glad it has finally been cleared up! :D

- Sammy
"If the squidman can't do it, no one can!!"

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