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Anvil of doom
Topic Started: 10th December 2007 - 12:52 AM (334 Views)
eldereth
Clanrat
My friend plays dwarfs and he swears by the anvil of doom in 2k+ battles. So we have an anvil with a runelord which he can give a 1+ rerollable AS and 3 runes of spellbreaking totalling up to 7 dispell dice, negating even the toughest of magic. there's also 2 anvil guards with 2+ saves in CC and a 4+ ward save against shooting. They're also unbreakable.

The rest of his army is purely CC oriented and he uses the anvil to increase his dwarfs charge range to 12" (move once in movement phase and again in his shooting phase) meaning he will get the charge if he needs to. The army would probably exist of 2 elite units that are either stubborn, resistant to fear, test on 1d6, ... + a BSB so there's no way they will run. He also has about 2 units of warriors and maybe a stone thrower, a bolt thrower and a gyrocopter.

I don't want to field a total gunline, and am at a loss as to how to respond to this. Any advice would be appreciated. (PS, he could also use the anvil to kill of any support units like pwgs, jezzails, weapon teams or gutter runners with the anvil, where he inflicts d6s4 wounds on any unit on the battlefield (d3 units if he rolls a 4+))

I am really set on taking the anvil though, even if I can likely ignore it. So far all I could come up with was a warlord with the fellblade cutting through a warrior unit and breaking through his lines, moving on to engage the anvil, or a couple of medium size units of poison wind globadiers skirmishing their way to the anvil.
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Niz'tizi'ihack
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Mad Harbringer of Mutation
Remember he can only use it once a turn.. if it's destroying your specialist units, he's not getting the charge.. also remember that if he's using it on more than 1 unit it's likely not to work.
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Tysp
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Warlord
Well, you could always use..well er, um gutter runners (tunneling teams), but many people think thats cheesy <_< I think most people would agree if your trying to take out a single unit eshin elites are the way to go.

If you wanted to ignore it, you could always set up a slave barrier. :P That is, if you have the money to buy 4 clanrat box sets to make them.
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eldereth
Clanrat
don't think eshin elites can even dent 2 dwarfs T4 2+ AS and the runelord T5 rerollable 1+ AS, and they're unbreakable. Apart from that, they're facing 6 str4 attacks, meaning about 2-3 eshin deaths each turn.

He's solely using the anvil for charging purposes, only attacking the support units if he doesn't need the extra move. He's also pretty cautious in using it, so he'll rarely fail his rolls.

I've added my current army list to take him on to encourage comments.

Warlord 199pts
Heavy Armour; Shield; Fell Blade; Talisman of Protection; general

Assassin 155pts
2 poisoned handweapons, Warpstone Stars

Chieftain 149pts
Heavy Armour; Battle Standard; Sacred Standard of the Horned rat

Plague Priest 131pts
Censer; Warpstone Amulet Sword of Might

28 Clanrats 165pts
Light Armour; Shield;full command

30 Clanrats
Light Armour; Shield;full command w/o champ 165pts

30 Clanrats 165pts
Light Armour; Shield;full command w/o champ

20 Clanrat Slaves 40pts

20 Clanrat Slaves 40pts

7 Poison Wind Globadiers 70 pts

7 Poison Wind Globadiers 70 pts

24 Plague Monks 242pts
frenzy, additional handweapon, full command, war banner

7 Gutter Runners 112pts
second handweapon, poisoned throwing stars

5 Gutter Runners
Poisoned and second handweapon, tunneling team 85pts

Warp Lightning Cannon 100pts

Warp Lightning Cannon 100pts
-------
1988pts
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Rusty Tincanne
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...you can still call me Rusty Tincanne if you want, though.

Well, you can always take your mimis and walk them forward letting him attack. And not do anything in return. If you find him getting frustrated, just smile and nod - don't get heated, just let him know that that his list is beautiful and unbeatable, so congratulations. Let him know that that is how the game would play regardless of anything you might do. Your rats will just stand and await death.

Remind him that it isn't his fault - GW made the rules and, yes, he is playing with a legal army. Flatter him by telling him over and over again that his fantastic general-ship has helped him find perfection.

Then don't play him again until he changes to a more balanced list.


Oh. There was a threadon this a while again. Here. I like Sings point at the end.

Good luck.


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eldereth
Clanrat
That's a great link, thx!

Though I think sings point is unvalid as the whole discussion is all about the d6 str 4 I-don't-need-no-LOS-nor-range-and-you-can't-dispell-me rune, which isn't really my problem, because the dwarf player knows that and primarily uses the movement rune, which WILL get him his points back because it means his dwarfs get to pick their combats and charge, which can be as early as turn 2.

I also think the anvil is made of cheese, but I believe every army has a weakness, even cheesy ones, and they can be beaten. I'm also too stubborn in my beliefs (a stubborn skaven :blink:) to refuse to play him.

Anyway, thanks for all the help!
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shadow harbinger
Clanrat
If you can live without the shooting from the Warpstone Cannons, switch your BSB banner to the Storm Banner to screw up the Anvil of Doom. As the Anvil activates in the shooting phase it falls into the category of being a warmachine that needs a 4+ to work for that turn and subsequent turns if you get lucky and the banner doesn't run out. It might allow you to get the charge on the Dwarfs rather than the other way around.
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Vermitt Stain
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Brain: There's only one ride that interests me - the incredible thrill ride of taking over the world! Pinky: Mmm, I think there's a height requirement for that ride.
if you really were hell bent on killing the anvil you could give the assasain gouger and then he wouldnt get the armour save plauge priest power bands + fail or census no save as he would be stenght 10(may get stuck with his dipelling) and then you got your general whos got the fellblade and i would give up one of the connons to get a nother 2 slave units and just use them to hold up the rest of his army. providing everything works this would mean that he's facing about 11-12 attacks witch he would'nt get an amour save against it could work but i've nether gone against one.
149707 people died on my birthday ...... it wasnt me

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harleysa


Ive only fought a Dwarf player feilding the new anvil once with my skaven, but using a large tunneling team with poisoned weapons did the trick. Admitedly I rolled well and he didn't but it worked.

My other thought is to send a token expendable force forward to be slaughtered as you blast away with the cannon, with a bit of luck his army formation will break up (what with flank charges and overruns on his part) enought for you to jump on his units in a more peicemeal fashion than he would like

Other than that I don't know. Dwarves are hard and, with the anvil, cheese.
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Muk-Muk
Stormvermin
MSU your Jezzails and PWGs so that even if he spends a turn targeting one unit you still have plently more where that came from. I'm not saying you need to max out yout Special choices in Jezzails by any means. I like units of 4 PWG per Clanrat unit in my army just to act as support or distraction. Most his shooting will probably be dedicated to more important tasks. I mean honestly who shoots a bolt thrower at a PWG? *shakes paw at elf-things* Dwarf-Slayer and Brass Orb are fun little items to pull out in these instances. Since most of his army is combat orientated your Gutter Runners can easily take out your opponent's warmachines (provided they are not entrenched). Your definately going to need a BSB and a Warlord (Dwarf-Slayer) but from there your choices are going to be fairly limited as 2 Warlock Engineers are not going to break a Dwarf players magic defense. Master Moulders can be a decent option if you decide to field Rat Ogres. Chieftans being the next viable option followed by the Plague Priest then the Assassin. Plague Censor Bearers, Plague Monks (War Banner), and Plague Priest (Plague Censor) can be good against units without characters. Pick and choose your fights and don't be afraid to flee from the Dwarf-things if you know it doesn't make any sense to stick around at least they will not be getting the VP for breaking you or destroying you in combat if you took a banner. Stormvermin might matchup well against Dwarf Warrior units because of the higher WS. That's really all I can think of at the moment.
"Let one fall so that ten more might take its place"
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Skavenblight
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Chieftain
I feel your pain I have a dwarf friend who insists on bringing the anvil at 2k, the only difference is that he rather likes the thorgrim cahracter too, so I get the added bonus of his better Ancient Power abilities. Usually he does the damage one, but as it's d3 units it's incredibly annoying, not necssarily due to the damage it deals, but the fact that they move half movement for the next turn <_< . In addition to that he gets his runes off on a better chance and he misfires the anvil less.
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Mormeguil
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baby nurgle
Well so far I must say that dwarf are incredibly hard for skaven to beat. Now the best way is probably to kill it's support. Don't try to take out the big block you probably won't succeed unless you use the fear causing banner (but that's still risky).

Now is army is going to be smaller then your's so deploy all skirmisher, canon and smaller units first to force him to choose a position before you do. After that the position of the anvil should become pretty clear and the posistion of it's shooting and warmachine too.

Now, you just have to block it's large dwarf units with slave and plague monks (they will probably be forced to charge anyway) and use the rest of your clanrats to kill every support units. Only take on the large dwarf unit if you have a back or flank and the opponent doesnt have the big banner since you will need overwhelming combat resolution to beat ld 10 re-rollable.

The other solution possible is to simply hide and take table quarter then use your gutter runenr and assassin to take out warmachine. You will probably get a boring game and a minor vicotry but it's going to work,
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Vermitt Stain
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Brain: There's only one ride that interests me - the incredible thrill ride of taking over the world! Pinky: Mmm, I think there's a height requirement for that ride.
i recently played dwarf player who had an anvil of doom so i used the storm banner to hold his shooting for a while and had two units of gutter runners to take out his artilary before the banner ran out. also the storm banner affects the anvil of doom i beilive so he will have to roll a 4+ before he could use it .
149707 people died on my birthday ...... it wasnt me

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