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OH MY GOD!!!; The Empire
Topic Started: 18th December 2006 - 03:19 AM (2,563 Views)
chieftainskritchskritch
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The Freshmaker

Ok, i know everyone was crying about the "clockwork horse" that the empire gets, but have any of you guys actually READ the empire book? Here's some of the new stuff they're getting:

* Pigeon bombs (small template weapon with around 36" range for engineers)
* Grenade launchers (crappier jezzails for engineers)
* Rocket launchers (a war machine that works pretty much like a black powder stone thrower. It looks like a friggin surface to air missile launcher!!!)
* Steam tank becomes "official" (ie, in the book).

And thats just the BEGINNING!

Also, they are getting 5, yes 5, special characters. These are Karl Franz, luthor huss, the grand theogonist, that lvl 4 gold wizard dude and Kurt Helborg!

So, i was thinking, if this is the trend, will WE get 5 special characters? (Im hoping for thanquol, throt, skrolk, ikit and queek, seeing as the deathmaster is in the SoC book.
You kids these days have it so easy, what with your Plague Furnaces and your Hellpit Abominations and your Bonebreaker Warlords. Back in MY day, all we had was Slaves and Clanrats!...and auto-hit Ratling Guns...and skirmishing Jezzails...and 2D6 Warp Lightning...and Lead From The Back...wait, what was my arguement again?
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Sammy the Squid
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Back to retirement!

Orcs and Gobbos got 5 special characters too. And all were pretty bad, except Grimgore who was revoltingly underpriced... <_< So it doesnt really surprise me that Empire will get 5 too. This will probably turn into a trend throughout the army books, but the characters wont be as uber-powerful as they used to be...

As for the rest of the Empire stuff, yeh, Ive heard of it. Initially it sounds scary (and looks much worse!), but the rules arent that uber-good, and more importantly, State combat troops have gone down in price, so people are more likely to take them. Those huge rocket batteries arent very accurate, Hellblasters now need to roll to hit, and alot of these guns can only be given to Engineers, who generally arent worth taking over Priests, Captains and Wizards. Ive also heard the Steam Tank now has a consistant set of rules that fit nicely into the game system. So combined with cheaper state troops, gun lines wont be as common as current edition, even with all the new weird Empire stuff coming out...

Im sticking with my current Empire though. None of this new stuff for me. It just doesnt fit into a Fantasy game. More State troops and Greatswords for me ^_^

- Sammy
"If the squidman can't do it, no one can!!"

Wins/Losses/Draws

Skaven Clan Rattenkrieg - 108/58/20
Dark Elves - 44/14/8
Hochland Empire - 33/14/4
Malkavian Vampires - 23/22/4
Beastmen - 50/25/2

Have not completed a Painting Vow since July 07!!
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SingTheScreams
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Call me Sings

i guess at thanquol, throt, nurglitch, DMS, and ikit claw. that's one from each major clan plus thanquol. queek is a maybe, i don't know who they'd substituite him for. Maybe DMS, as skritches says, because he's in the SoC book.

pidgeon bombs sound okay. are they one use only? ive been waiting for ages for the steam tank to become official, otherwise they wouldn't have made new rules for it after the 6th ed. empire army book came out. engineers will have to replace wizards in artillery armies, helblasters will still decimate stuff (without being quite so cheap), and I like troop-based Empire armies.
I like eating them for breakfast. If they have a decent balance of forces they can pull off some suprising things.
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arqueek
 
no need to worry for soul, instead starts worshipping STS and slaughtering unbelievers in his holy name.
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Sammy the Squid
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Back to retirement!

I dont think Pigeon Bombs are One use only, because they have a risk of dropping the bomb on the Empire Engineer if I remember correctly... Plus there is a high chance of them not working at all...

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engineers will have to replace wizards in artillery armies


Very true. A few Hochland Long Rifle shots and there wont be many enemy Wizards left to trouble the rest of the Artillery Army with magic...

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), and I like troop-based Empire armies. If they have a decent balance of forces they can pull off some suprising things.


They really can! I used to have a very negative view on Empire troops, with their average statlines, lack of armour (besides Swordsmen) and their above average points cost compared to other armies. Bit since Ive played with them they have really surprised me. Ive seen a group of Halberdiers beat off and run down 15 Chosen Chaos Warriors, Spearmen hold a Dark Elf highborn and executioner bodyguard up for over half a game, Swordsmen kill off a Dwarf Lord and retinue... If used correctly, a well balanced Empire troop army can be very rewarding to play with. And now that they cost a point less, I can fit another squad into my army! ^_^

- Sammy
"If the squidman can't do it, no one can!!"

Wins/Losses/Draws

Skaven Clan Rattenkrieg - 108/58/20
Dark Elves - 44/14/8
Hochland Empire - 33/14/4
Malkavian Vampires - 23/22/4
Beastmen - 50/25/2

Have not completed a Painting Vow since July 07!!
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Frankensqueek
Doomwheel Driver
It sounds okay apart from the rocket and grenade launchers; they sound absolutely absurd. Pidgeon bombs sound fine to me, but I don't like the new mad-scientist theme that the Empire are getting. Its just not fantasy anymore (plus the Skaven are the ONLY mad-scientists allowed ^_^ ).


James
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Rusty
 
As for nominations: Frankie, of course, because I love to vote for him and watch him fail :unsure: 


My Army
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Skaven Lord Vinshqueek
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Bunny ear says flop

Pidgeon bombs have already been mentioned somewhere between UK WD #260 - #270 as inventions of engineers, so that isn't very new. Though, according to my sources it's a S4 small template that gets dropped somewhere on the battlefield. Grenade launcher would be a S5 shortbow, though both items would be move-or-fire, which (to me) makes them suddenly a lot less scary. Move-or-fire means static target = better shooting results. :D Rocket battery is basically a more fancier version of a rocklobber... (At quite a few points).

Greetz
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Mebob
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Hmm, *was hating the fact that empiure got these* but know that ive ehard more aboutt hem, alot of them sound....not that good, i was dreading to find a every empire army beingof artillary based.
But from the sounds of it, we wont be seeing much of them :)
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Mormeguil
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baby nurgle
well the rules are not that bad it's just fluff wise it doens't seem to fit that good. But from what I heard it will be possible to make an inquisition style army more easily in the new book.
I have a few bare metal dark elf model for sale, if interested pm me.
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Chieftain Cazgar
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Prophet of Plastic
ok, i have played with an empire army using the new rule book. and also watched 2 games with it used.

the army that was used by me and the staff guy was:

lvl 2 mage
2 warrior preists with nasty underpriced magic items (one can take a random enemy spell, and it can keep on doing it)

20 swordsmen with full command and 10 hand gunners detatchment
20 militia
10 hand gunners

5 outriders
a mortor
a steam tank

warrior preists now generate dispell dice, and the models for them are FANTASTIC lol.

the steam tank did pretty good for me, however, like all big, tough damage dealers, it became the target of everything. i was lucky when i used it because i went against a VC army. previously the army had been used against empire and dwarfs. against any army with guns, the steam tank will get shot down and killed. i didn't watch the dwarf game, but against the empire the tank died on turn 2 due to heavy cannon barage.

in my game against VC i didn't have to worry about cannons lol. second turn i charged into a banshee, over ran into a unit of grave guard and a strigoi. i used 4 steam points and managed to wipe out the entire unit of 20 grave guard and wound the strigoi. outriders aren't the mounted machine guns i imagined them to be. he charged the tank with some VC knights and the tank was down to 3 wounds. so then the warrior preist comes dashing over, prays to sigmar to get the tank fully functioning again. the VC rolled a double 1 to stop it. the tank is now back on 10 wounds. i gotta say the tank won it for me that game, that and my other guns lol.

i didn't really have much in the way of infantry foot soldiers anyway, but i can see empire using this sort of heavy artillery power to good effect against any army lacking in the missile department. i won my match with the empire, the staff guy lost both his games against the empire and dwarfs.

so, i have read through the rule book and used the army, they arn't that good, but they arn't half bad lol
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cole
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Warlord
Couldn't you have a bunch of warrior priests following a steam tank around all day healing it? And are steam tanks 0-1 choices? Is it true they are like chariots?
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SingTheScreams
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Call me Sings

im pretty sure the steam tank doesn't work using a normal wounds system, but instead takes damage points which also affect its performance. the more damaged a steam tank is, the less it can do per turn (as there is a higher risk of the boiler rupturing, i believe). damage points aren't wounds, and therefore can't be healed by the warrior priests' spells.


stop me if I'm wrong, though
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arqueek
 
no need to worry for soul, instead starts worshipping STS and slaughtering unbelievers in his holy name.
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Chieftain Cazgar
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Prophet of Plastic
nope, pretty sure it has wounds. we kept saying how it had been on 3 wounds and the preist had healed it back up to full and nobody disputed the preist being able to do that.

i could be wrong, i've only skimmed through the book. but the staff guy had read and re-read the rules over and over for the past month and seemed pretty adament that the preist could do it.

the tank causes D3 impact hits for every steam point it uses plus an extra D3 for the sake of it lol. against undead it's pretty awesome because whatever wounds you cause on it (over 10 in my case) are practically doubled when it comes round to combat res time.

btw, my tank didn't fire a single shot all game, it just careered into things and flattened them lol.
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Frankensqueek
Doomwheel Driver
The rules that You were refering to Sings are the rules that appeared in a white dwarf and are the rules that I and nearly everyone else know and use. However I think they were rewritten for the new Empire Army Book. I THINK.


James
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Rusty
 
As for nominations: Frankie, of course, because I love to vote for him and watch him fail :unsure: 


My Army
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Chieftain Cazgar
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Prophet of Plastic
yeah i think the tank rules were simplified and stuff. they're included inside the army book now. also i think it only has T6 now, i don't know what it was before but T6 isn't that great in my opinion, not when it costs 300 points lol.
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SingTheScreams
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Call me Sings

well t6 means it can;t get hit by the bell, anyways (it would almost be better if it were t7). it'll probably find a lot more use now that it's got normal rules though
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arqueek
 
no need to worry for soul, instead starts worshipping STS and slaughtering unbelievers in his holy name.
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