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Stupid fricken Dwarves argh!!!; As you can tell, I have a slight problem
Topic Started: 30th September 2004 - 12:28 PM (435 Views)
chieftainskritchskritch
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The Freshmaker

Can anyone help me?

I regularily play against a Dwarven engineerers guild army and I have a problem with my friend's army, particularily his Dwarf Lord. He gives the lord a 2+ save (1+ in combat), a 2+ ward save against shooting, puts him as a cannon crewman with the cannon having the valiant rune (to make him unbreakable) and the stupid model has about 5 attacks with a toughness of 5. Since he is an engineerers guild army, he takes an insane amout of war machines (something like 2 bolt throwers, a cannon, and an organ gun). Everything gets shot to pieces before getting to his battle line and, when it does get there, the characters (who are similar to the lord), eat my units for breakfast with a pint of Bugmans. I wont say no to him using an "ask your opponent" army (because I'll never hear the end of it) and I cant crack the lord. Massed numbers would be the way to go, but they either die or cant break him because of the valiant rune. On the plus side, I always employ Thanquol and Boneripper in my 2000pt force (they are too awesome!) and I wont part with them. I am able to get heaps of magic off and his army is small. We also always play a "kill em all" mission, which involves no turn limit and the death of every enemy model on the board. What should I do? (oh, and I dont have stormvermin).
You kids these days have it so easy, what with your Plague Furnaces and your Hellpit Abominations and your Bonebreaker Warlords. Back in MY day, all we had was Slaves and Clanrats!...and auto-hit Ratling Guns...and skirmishing Jezzails...and 2D6 Warp Lightning...and Lead From The Back...wait, what was my arguement again?
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Mutator
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Retired fat dude

Send a 5-base swarm into the Lord's cannon.

It will (hopefully) get there on turn 2 or 3, and stop it from firing for the rest of the game.

Do this enough and maybe he'll stop that tactic.
Mostly harmless
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Deathmaster Mik
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Claw of the Shadow

Best tactic:

Don't give him a fat juicy shooting target: Just use nightrunners/clanrats/slaves.. LOTS of em. You'll win on ranks/banner/numbers/(flank?).. not on fighting-prowess

Biiiig units. (30+..even slaves)
Don't set up your units close together and put all your units on the edge of the table (not the edge of the deploy zone, cause he can guess distance easier)
Storm Banner (activated at start of his turn 3, cause he'll be able to guess better at closer range..and because your big units can soak some missile-casualties anyway)

And the best advice: Ignore his general (he's CREW?? rofl..never saw that before..) :)
You can easily avoid the crew of a war-machine... practiaclly this spells he cannot seriously use his 400 point char :P
If he has one buff unit: avoid it. The rest should be cake. Wipe it out and you win. *bsb*

P.S: post a list of his army... I'll make one to counter
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whiteclone
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Clan Kynix Warmonger
An army like this would be very small no doubt. Like Mik, I can't believe his lord is in crew, but hey, bonus for you. Since you will easily outnumber him, just move to his flanks (both of them), and that character in the first rank will be out of combat so hopefully you'll break them. If he sets up so you can't hit any flanks, you can use a rat trap (slaves move in, but never charge, he overruns, you flank unit and move others in behind).
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Rattsu
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Is writing Dragon Age fanfiction

whiteclone
Sep 30 2004, 12:29 PM
Since you will easily outnumber him, just move to his flanks (both of them), and that character in the first rank will be out of combat so hopefully you'll break them.

Unfortunately the crew works like skirmishers... they have no flanks, they are just lined up to the front of the unit that attacks them...
I am currently writing an epic Dragon Age 2 adventure that can be found HERE!! or on my deviantart.

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vasquisk
a.k.a. I-D-I-O-T (Dark Lords of the Overempire)
chieftainskritchskritch
Sep 30 2004, 01:28 PM
He gives the lord a 2+ save (1+ in combat), a 2+ ward save against shooting, puts him as a cannon crewman with the cannon having the valiant rune (to make him unbreakable) and the stupid model has about 5 attacks with a toughness of 5.



I am able to get heaps of magic off and his army is small.

*Vasquisk hums a merry tune to himself while polishing a spherical brass object and thinking about "leaping" around somewhere, where he could possibly hit someone with his orb...*
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Deathmaster Mik
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Claw of the Shadow

Rattsu
Sep 30 2004, 06:41 PM
whiteclone
Sep 30 2004, 12:29 PM
Since you will easily outnumber him, just move to his flanks (both of them), and that character in the first rank will be out of combat so hopefully you'll break them.

Unfortunately the crew works like skirmishers... they have no flanks, they are just lined up to the front of the unit that attacks them...

Like I said: Don't attack it, ignore it. ;)

Make shooting useless by sheer numbers and the fact that you have NO ace unit.
(that actually helps eachother: no ace unit means cheap units means numberssss)
Add the storm banner, so you make sure none of your units start running in THE most important turns (prolly 3 and 4).. and you have this match in the pocket I think

Remember, you don't just win by using YOUR strenght, but by denying the enemy HIS! (If I start sounding like Sun Tzu too much... knock me over the head plz) :P
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chieftainskritchskritch
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The Freshmaker

Thanks for the advice guys. I also just remembered stuff to add to this dwarf moron's profile. He alo has a 4+ ward save and a rune that lets him re-roll failed saves. This means that, since you can take an armour and a ward save, he can reroll any failed armour saves, then take his ward saves and reroll any of those. Hr will not run because he is unbreakable. Also, I have already thought of the brass ord, but he has an initiative of about 7. Help!
You kids these days have it so easy, what with your Plague Furnaces and your Hellpit Abominations and your Bonebreaker Warlords. Back in MY day, all we had was Slaves and Clanrats!...and auto-hit Ratling Guns...and skirmishing Jezzails...and 2D6 Warp Lightning...and Lead From The Back...wait, what was my arguement again?
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s'nkeep
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Ajax = warpstone juice

id check the faq, rerolling a ward save is damn powerful.

int 7 for a dwarf thats just wrong.
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Jackety
FEAR THE LEMMING!
...Whoa. Stop. Wait. Halt. Dwarves will not...no...CAN NOT! Have initative over 3. Why? Because. Thats it. They are short, stubby, and slow. Our SLAVES have high initative then their lords. Just...no. There is a rune that always makes him strike first, yes. But that doesn't improve his Initative. NOTHING in the dwarven army improves their initative. Look in the book! You won't find it. Make him show you! He won't find it.

...If worst comes to worst...then what you do is attack him with a Assasssin using Weeping Blades. True; you must get lucky. But, that single luck will win you. Even if he has four wounds, you only need two hits in and he dies. You hit on fours, you wound on fours, he gets a 3+ armor save...you need some luck in this. You get two hits, two wounds, he fails both saves, you get to high numbers...and that Dwarf Lord is Deado.

Also, only Engineers can join Warmachine crews...can't they?

And guess what; the Warmachine gets the rune. Take a Warplighting cannon. One lucky shot, and so long Unbreakability!
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chieftainskritchskritch
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The Freshmaker

O.k, I'll ask about the initiative thing. He is allowed to play as a crew member because he is from the engineerers guild. I should probably check anout the rerolling ward saves too. Now that I think about it, he does seem rather nasty......a bit too nasty I think!
You kids these days have it so easy, what with your Plague Furnaces and your Hellpit Abominations and your Bonebreaker Warlords. Back in MY day, all we had was Slaves and Clanrats!...and auto-hit Ratling Guns...and skirmishing Jezzails...and 2D6 Warp Lightning...and Lead From The Back...wait, what was my arguement again?
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whiteclone
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Clan Kynix Warmonger
sorry skritchskritch, i guess my help was no help at all.
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phordicus
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Battlemaster of Clan Skrikkik

chieftainskritchskritch
Sep 30 2004, 06:29 PM
He alo has a 4+ ward save and a rune that lets him re-roll failed saves. This means that, since you can take an armour and a ward save, he can reroll any failed armour saves, then take his ward saves and reroll any of those.

what a crock.

there is no such thing as rerolls for ward saves. snatch his book from him and read the rune description. i'll bet $X it says "reroll failed armor saves".
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Skaskrit Venomclaw
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Ex-Councilrat

I'm positive the rune allows no re-rolling ward-saves. I use those runes all the time, so does every other Dwarf general I know. You can only re-roll armour saves with the Rune of Resistance.

On initiative: there is a weapon rune which increases your initiative. There's a bit of discussion on whether runes/weapons like these would help against characteristic checks. The general opinion seems to be "no", and some items specifically state the bonus is only used in close combat.
"I have a post-Armageddon vision. We and all other large animals are gone. Rodents emerge as the ultimate post-human scavengers. They gnaw their way through New York, London and Tokyo... within 5 million years, a whole range of new species replace the ones we know. Herds of giant grazing rats are stalked by sabre-toothed predatory rats. Given enough time, will a species of intelligent, cultivated rats emerge?"

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Garovan
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Quote:
 
He alo has a 4+ ward save and a rune that lets him re-roll failed saves. This means that, since you can take an armour and a ward save, he can reroll any failed armour saves, then take his ward saves and reroll any of those.

I think you guys are misunderstanding this. He said he has a 4+ ward save and re-rollable saves. But that is a re-rollable ARMOUR save. I think the mistake just came from the proximity.
For Middenheim! (Hey, it if it worked for Empire, it'll work for us!)
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