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Marlord Meekits Destroyers; 2000pts warlord army list
Topic Started: 28th April 2004 - 01:58 PM (448 Views)
rykos
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Warlord of Clan Meekit

well after trying a few games with a grey seer and the screaming bell, which proved to be very expensive and certainly not proportional to its points, I'm going to be giving a warlord a chance with a couple of engineers for casting and dispelling during the magic phase! here's the force, let me know what you think...

Warlord Meekits Destroyers 2000 Pts - Skaven Army

1 Warlord @ 193 Pts
General; Shield; Desolate Blade; Warpstone Armour; Warpstone Amulet

1 Warlock Engineer @ 135 Pts
Supercharged WP Accumulator; Upgraded Warp-Energy Condenser; Warp Blades; 1 Warpstone Token; Storm Daemon; Dispel Scroll

1 Warlock Engineer @ 115 Pts
Supercharged WP Accumulator; Upgraded Warp-Energy Condenser; Warp Blades; 1 Warpstone Token; Warpscroll

1 Plague Priest @ 99 Pts
2ndWeapon; Bands of Power

30 Clanrats @ 205 Pts
Spear; Light Armour; Shield; Standard; Musician; Clawleader

30 Clanrats @ 175 Pts
Light Armour; Shield; Standard; Musician; Clawleader

29 Stormvermin @ 337 Pts
Halberd; Heavy Armour; Standard; Musician; Fangleader; Banner of the Swarm

1 Weapon Team @ [60] Pts
Ratling Gun

3 Rat Swarms @ 135 Pts

10 Warplock Jezzail teams @ 200 Pts

5 Gutter Runners @ 114 Pts
2ndWeapon; Poisoned Hand Weapons; Throwing Stars; Black Skaven

19 Plague Monks @ 202 Pts
2ndWeapon; Standard; Musician; Plague Deacon; Banner of Burning Hatred

5 Plague Censer Bearers @ 85 Pts

Casting Pool: 6

Dispel Pool: 4

Models in Army: 137


Total Army Cost: 1995
The Man-things will pay, yes, yes, their places will burn, burn by my paw -- Warlord Meekit

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Verminous Fang
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Well, just a few points.

1) If you thought that a vampire force's magic phase was too strong against a grey seer on a bell, well, this will be tough (did you remember that the bell confers magic resistance to the unit that pushes it? I noticed in the battle report that he used some magic against the stormvermin). With only 4 dispell dice and only 1 dispell scrol, vampires, elves and slaan will walk over you in the magic phase. Which isn't so bad, if you can prepare for it.

2) On that note, a unit of slaves (or 2) would go over great to prevent missiles and spells from hitting your main force.

Other than that, it looks pretty solid. I would tell you to take another weapon team, but I know what response I'd get. :P I've been intrigued by the banner of the swarm, so be sure to let us know how it does.

Also, you played early this week. Are you still going to play on Thursday?
Go forth my brethren, that we shall nibble at the roots of the old world!

We are the rats in the shadows. We hold the blades of corruption, aimed at the very heart of the Old World. We are The Council of Thirteen.

Second place in the UnderEmpire painting competition!

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rykos
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Warlord of Clan Meekit

well I think the vampires magic phase was a little excessive, 12 power dice, and 11 spells to choose from (the vampire had all 6 necromatic spells!) and I think my luck wasn't with me dispell wise, rolling 4 dice and failing to dispell a 10 or 11+ :unsure: anyway at least with this force I go into the battle knowing that I'll be outclassed in the magic phase, instead of going in 10/5 and just failing, lol, oh even with magic resistance, I still managed to fail to dispell the gaze of nagash against the stormvermin!

well slaves are a possibility, as soon as I get my backside into gear and paint a load (going to use a load of my old metal clanrats as slaves), however given the size of units and speed of getting into combat, generally missile fire/magic isn't too much of an issue... (watch this space for a reversal, lol)

as for weapons teams... there are 3 responses... 1) I only have 1 ratling... 2) I'm painting WFTs as we speak (and have been for 3 weeks, along with PWGs and night runners, lol) and 3) only space I have atm is with my gutter runners, though I may be able to fit in 2 WFTs (lose gutter runners, and warpscroll), but not yet anyway...

I doubt I'll be playing on thursday, the misses has the night off of work, so I have to be very persuasive (or not play on the tuesday), also getting a game will be hard on thursdays due to a 40K and necromunda campaign being run atm! (tuesdays is bloodbowl and warhammer! with a bit of 40K)
The Man-things will pay, yes, yes, their places will burn, burn by my paw -- Warlord Meekit

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Verminous Fang
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Quote:
 
1) I only have 1 ratling... 2) I'm painting WFTs as we speak (and have been for 3 weeks, along with PWGs and night runners, lol) and 3) only space I have atm is with my gutter runners, though I may be able to fit in 2 WFTs (lose gutter runners, and warpscroll), but not yet anyway...


Yep, that's the one I was expecting. :D

Quote:
 
however given the size of units and speed of getting into combat, generally missile fire/magic isn't too much of an issue


That's what I used to think. Some of my opponents have shown me the error of my ways. 4 RBTs was bad. About 5 units of 10 skinks (it may have been 4, but at that point the extra unit is superfluous anyways) was also pretty bad. The Empire players were pretty rough as well. By the time I played against the dwarf player, I igured out that slaves were essential. Crossbows, thunderers, catapults, cannon (the organ gun did me the great favor of blowing itself up before it could hurt me - it was the first time that guy used one, and probably the last :lol: ).

Well, I guess you'll just have to play on Tuesdays, then. At least the restriction isn't something like any day of the week that doesn't end in 'y'. :D
Go forth my brethren, that we shall nibble at the roots of the old world!

We are the rats in the shadows. We hold the blades of corruption, aimed at the very heart of the Old World. We are The Council of Thirteen.

Second place in the UnderEmpire painting competition!

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rykos
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Warlord of Clan Meekit

glad I didn't disappoint, lol

as for missile fire, tbh I haven't faced an empire 'gun line' yet, though one fo the staff members at my store has one (he doesn't play it that often) I've faced dwarves with a mass of crossbows and thunderers, cannons and bolt throwers (he tried a stone thrower and didn't do much with it/like it, also the flame cannon, which was destroyed on the first turn in both games!)

in fact atm, with the armies I face, I'm quite willing to hold back for a turn and just Jezzail and warplightning my opponents, thats how little and ineffective their shooting is, though I'll be facing 2000pts of HEs soon and I have a rough idea what I'm going to face :unsure:

well I'm happy to stick to tuesdays (sort of) and thankfully, the misses isn't that bad, :lol:
The Man-things will pay, yes, yes, their places will burn, burn by my paw -- Warlord Meekit

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Verminous Fang
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Quote:
 
and thankfully, the misses isn't that bad,


I think the correct wording is "the misses is a great and caring person", you know, in case she's looking over your shoulder... :lol:
Go forth my brethren, that we shall nibble at the roots of the old world!

We are the rats in the shadows. We hold the blades of corruption, aimed at the very heart of the Old World. We are The Council of Thirteen.

Second place in the UnderEmpire painting competition!

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rykos
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Warlord of Clan Meekit

actually, it's true, lol

anyway, I'm playing HEs 2000pts (probalby 2 units of 13ish archers, 1-2 RBTs, 1-2 units of spearmen, swordmasters and a only couple of low lvl mages) so the question is, which list shall I use? the grey seer bell force (give it another try) or the warlord force?

I'm swaying to give the grey seer and bell another attempt, mainly to see if the bell can have an effect and the magic resistance will help against fortune is fickle and drain magic, what do you think?
The Man-things will pay, yes, yes, their places will burn, burn by my paw -- Warlord Meekit

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Verminous Fang
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Well, I am partial to a Grey Seer led force. But if you're pretty sure you'll only see a few low level mages, the warlord force should be OK. The elf shooting phase may be rough, but if you advance fast enough you should be alright (I think).

2 units of archers and 1-2 RBTs is pretty light on the missile weapons. Jezzails and censor beares should be fairly safe (jezzails should be at -2 the whole game, CBs at -1). Keep the censor bearers in front of the plague monks (minimizing the banner's effect) which will also shield the monks from missile fire. I'm mostly concerned about the clanrats and stormvermin, though he shouldn't get a panic on you for at least 2 turns....

BS 4, long range, 4+ hits, S3, T3 (assumption of HE archers - pretty sure I'm right), 4+ wounds, 5+ saves. So, assuming he concentrates fire on one unit, 26 shots, 13 hits, call it 7 wounds, 2 saves, 5 dead in the first turn, not enough to panic. RBTs are less effective at that range, giving only one shot if he wants to pierce ranks, 50-50 chance to hit, or if he scatters, then it's like above (but S4, I think). So 6 at 4+ to hit, 3 hit, 1-2 wound, maybe 1 save. So, on average, if he concentrates all fire on one unit, he may be able to cause a panic check in the first round, but it leaves your other large blocks untouched. In close combat, he's a bit better than the spear rats, but not really enough to notice (well, those hand weapons may have a tough time of it - maybe their improved save will help against HE spears).

I think this list has more going for it, as long as you're pretty sure he's not fielding a Level 4 mage.
Go forth my brethren, that we shall nibble at the roots of the old world!

We are the rats in the shadows. We hold the blades of corruption, aimed at the very heart of the Old World. We are The Council of Thirteen.

Second place in the UnderEmpire painting competition!

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rykos
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Warlord of Clan Meekit

well it's all dependant on if he fields a lvl 4 mage or not, and if he does I'll realistically need the seer or conceed the magic phase (haveing fortune is fickle and drain magic cast on my engineers) the seer as mentioned has magic resistance fortunatly... though given my casting/dispelling rolls... but that can't be changed!

you're about right on the hand weapon clanrats front, though I'm contemplating a few changes... 1 the grey seer going into the hand weapon unit, and using them more as a pushing unit for the bell, and the spears and stormvermin as actual fighting units (losing the 2 fighting slots due to the bell is quite a disadvantage) I'm a little concerned about him targetting the bell, tho 1 in 5 hits hitting the bell (wounding on 6s with a 3+ save) and the other hitting the seer (wounding on 5s with a 5+ save and a ward save, 5+ I think), the umbranner being in the stormvermin (to keep them alive, he stopped targetting them after discovering it) and the cover from the censors on the plague monks (as you said) though I suspect he'll target the jezzails mainly (they did a lot of damage previously)

as for panic tests, well the unit pushing the bell is immune... and the other 2 units if he targets 1 of them well 1 may panic, the rest won'd due to being higher unit strength...

warplightning and jezzails should account for his RBTs and then archers (then swordmasters! but with a -3 on casting roll, I may not target the swordmasters)

it's going to be an interesting game (he knows roughly what I'll be playing and me him!)
The Man-things will pay, yes, yes, their places will burn, burn by my paw -- Warlord Meekit

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Verminous Fang
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The problem with panic, is that it could affect jezzails, gutter runners, WPGs and WLCs. Otherwise, I agree that it isn't much of a problem when your blocks are about the same size (to start with :D ).
Go forth my brethren, that we shall nibble at the roots of the old world!

We are the rats in the shadows. We hold the blades of corruption, aimed at the very heart of the Old World. We are The Council of Thirteen.

Second place in the UnderEmpire painting competition!

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rykos
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Warlord of Clan Meekit

well it won't be an issue anyway... I'm planning to drop the jezzails!!! and replace the umbranner with the storm banner (he may also use eagles!) which means he has at least 1 turn of 6s to hit :D other than that I made a few changes...

added in a tunnel team (yeah I know, but I have to try them sometime!) I got a WFT in there :D now all I have to do is paint 1!!! :lol: switched the bell to the hand weapon unit, just to see how that goes really... er and a few other changes, which you'll have to make out below, lol

Grey Seer Scarish's Conquerers2000 Pts - Skaven Army

1 Grey Seer @ 660 Pts
General; 4 Warpstone Tokens; Warpscroll; Dispel Scroll; Warpstone Amulet

1 Screaming Bell

24 Clanrats @ 145 Pts
Light Armour; Shield; Standard; Musician; Clawleader

1 Chieftain @ 145 Pts
Battle Standard; Storm Banner

1 Warlock Engineer @ 135 Pts
Supercharged WP Accumulator; Upgraded Warp-Energy Condenser; Warp Blades; 1 Warpstone

Token; Storm Daemon; Dispel Scroll


1 Plague Priest @ 74 Pts
Flail

29 Stormvermin @ [307] Pts
Halberd; Heavy Armour; Musician; Fangleader

1 Weapon Team
Ratling Gun

30 Clanrats @ 280 Pts
Spear; Light Armour; Shield; Standard; Musician; Clawleader

1 Weapon Team
Warpfire Thrower

5 Gutter Runners Tunnelling Team @ 80 Pts
Tunnelling Team; 2ndWeapon; Poisoned Hand Weapons; Black Skaven

19 Plague Monks @ 202 Pts
2ndWeapon; Standard; Musician; Plague Deacon; Banner of Burning Hatred

5 Plague Censer Bearers @ 85 Pts
Censer

Casting Pool: 10

Dispel Pool: 5

Models in Army: 119

Total Army Cost: 1985

I think I'm going to give the plague priest the amulet of protection, just cause I have 15 points spare, not decided yet tho!
The Man-things will pay, yes, yes, their places will burn, burn by my paw -- Warlord Meekit

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Verminous Fang
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Well, a 6+ ward save on a character with no armor is never a waste, IMHO. :D

The one thing I would change is to place one of the weapon teams (either one, it doesn't make a huge difference) attached to the unit pushing the bell. It's likely that the bell is a head-on force and at least one of the other units is for flanking (hard to do against elves, btw) and since you want your weapon teams stationary, the bell unit may be a good place for a weapon team.

You can probable drop the black skaven from the tunnel team, as they will go mainly for the artillery, and the 1 extra attack isn't usually necessary. I had one game where I didn't kill off the crew on the first round of combat, but that's a statistical fluke. 10 attacks, 4+ to hit, 4+ to wound (6's auto wound), that's 2-3 wounds. But it's really a non-issue for tunnelers (unless they don't show up :D ).
Go forth my brethren, that we shall nibble at the roots of the old world!

We are the rats in the shadows. We hold the blades of corruption, aimed at the very heart of the Old World. We are The Council of Thirteen.

Second place in the UnderEmpire painting competition!

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rykos
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Warlord of Clan Meekit

ah, but the tunnellers will also go for those damn archers! for the simple reason that they may be the only way of disposing of them (they shouldn't be too effective given the banner and everything being in combat)

as for the weapon team, I was thinking that actually as I was posting it, well it'll probably change to the WFT being attatched to the clanrats with bell by tuesday!

and I've already added the talisman of protection, I talked myself into it as afterall, I had the points, lol...

now all I have to do is wait till tuesday, and see what he turns up with, he may field a lvl4 mage as he's seen me use the bell recently, however I think I have enough 'curve balls' for him... he hasn't seen gutter runners (let alone tunnellers) the plague monks did badly last game and he hasn't seen censors or WFTs, he won't predict the lack of Jezzails (especially given how well they performed against him the last 2 times!), it's just a case of seeing if the best laid plans work out....
The Man-things will pay, yes, yes, their places will burn, burn by my paw -- Warlord Meekit

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Verminous Fang
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Yea, but what are the odds that this list will actually last until tuesday?

You may get sidetracked and decide to field an all moulder force Friday evening, and al Skryre force on Saturday, and then be back to Warlord Meekit by Tuesday. :D
Go forth my brethren, that we shall nibble at the roots of the old world!

We are the rats in the shadows. We hold the blades of corruption, aimed at the very heart of the Old World. We are The Council of Thirteen.

Second place in the UnderEmpire painting competition!

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rykos
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Warlord of Clan Meekit

now, that is true, however, I'm fairly content with the list and as such, I suspect it will last unchanged till tuesday, I've managed to ignore certain impulses... like a seer and 2 warlock engineers... so as long as I concentraight on other things, this list will remain unchanged... hopefully!
The Man-things will pay, yes, yes, their places will burn, burn by my paw -- Warlord Meekit

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