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Aalborg v Celtic- 25th November 08
Topic Started: Nov 22 2008, 02:19 PM (722 Views)
Keving
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desachi
Nov 26 2008, 06:34 PM
Honestly blair, I think we were coasting yesterday. I am still wondering how we lost it. To me that was the biggest freak result I have seen in many a year, and not sure it is as easy as saying we can blame it on anyone.

Floored everyone so it did, including Aalborg and their players judging from the statements they are coming out with today. Of course, none of that takes away from the fact that we left Denmark with nothing when we should have left with 3 points, a resounding win and then end of this ridiculous run of results. The game actually reminded me of the Lyon one where we needed a draw. A lot of people blamed Balde after that for something that was, IMO, just one of those things. A little like what happened to Caldwell last night. Thankfully there has been no demonisation of the Heid. The follow on thought was more sobering. That was Lyon, and a very good Lyon side, with an excellent CL pedigree. Last night was Aalborg.

Disappointed and floored, but then that is football sometimes. On the other side of the coin, we have done that to far better teams than us in recent times as well. In fact, this whole thing got me thinking to when the last time we were comfortable winners in Europe. Artmedia at home perhaps? Benfica at home was excellent as well. So, that would be one CL group stage game out of 17 then. Pretty shocking if you ask me. The results might have been good but for me the performances haven't been of the highest quality at all. Saved our best for Kilmarnock in this regard.

What does that tell me? Something that we all already knew, lack of quality, lack of ability to up things for the big games. In the three and a half seasons we have had, I think, only the run at the end of last season showed any real sense of consistent character, along with a spell when we beat TFOD and then Benfica the season before that. The season before that we had the run post Artmedia/Motherwell when we kept something like 11 or 12 clean sheets (with the Balde-McManus partnership) that put so much pressure on TFOD and helped us open up a massive and unassailable lead.

I loved it as much as anyone when McDonald nipped in to score the winner against Milan, and Donati did the same against Shakhtar, and of course Naka's sublime freekick against Man Utd and Boruc's penalty save, but to me, draws in each of those games would have been fair results as well.

There is the question, is there a move toward better quality or not? If not, why not? Why is it that we still don't know our best XI? Surely must be because there is plenty of "average" about the side and no certainty about a position. In fact, some of the players who are guaranteed a position should be nowhere near as secure as they are if you ask me.

Surely we should be aiming to improve as a club, in a managed, controlled way, bit by bit, season by season. Are we? If those in positions of power are to talk about team 1, 2 or 3, or whatever, then there should be some sort of improvement. Will be willing to see how that pans out by the end of the season but to be in denial about our lack of progress is the greater sin, and that needs to be addressed from the top, well above WGS's pay grade.

Ambition, ambition, ambition. :rolleyes:

If we had won away from home before I would class it as a freak result. But....it is now the believable unbelievable.
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tigergerry
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desachi
Nov 26 2008, 06:34 PM

Ambition, ambition, ambition. :rolleyes:
great post dessie
but can i add someting to your three words

ambition with pride ,emotion and the want to see your team be the best

:ynwa: :ynwa:
tigers gonna get ya
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Doc67
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Keving
Nov 26 2008, 08:03 PM
The team sitting 7th in the Danish Superliga took 4 points from us. It's akin to a one-armed blindman beating you at darts.

Lots of guid points guys but IMO it's more of a collective failing rather than a witch hunt of certain players and the manager.

We got what we deserved. Overall, the table disnny lie.

I've played a guy with one eye and one arm at darts!! Seriously




Good to be back!
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Mainser
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Doc67
Nov 27 2008, 10:42 AM

I've played a guy with one eye and one arm at darts!! Seriously

But did you win?
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Doc67
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Mainser
Nov 27 2008, 09:50 AM
Doc67
Nov 27 2008, 10:42 AM

I've played a guy with one eye and one arm at darts!! Seriously

But did you win?

Ahhhh!!! Thatd be telling!! :D :D




Good to be back!
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Roseanne
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Jinty
Nov 26 2008, 06:35 AM
is there indeed a mental block with this team away in europe? :shrug:

Not just this team. I've been saying this (that there is some kind of psychological block) since MON was here. Even with Hartson, Sutton and Larsson in our forward line, we couldn't get more than one point in any of our away games in the CL. This is not a comparison of the managers or teams btw, just an observation. We came close v Juventus but for that diving bastard and we were 1-1 with minutes to go in Milan and got hit with two late sucker punches. :( With us, it always seems to be an early sucker punch, a late sucker punch, a horrible result like 3-0 Shakhtar away, 2-0 Shakhtar away, I won't mention Artmedia :ph43r:. Or there is an own goal, a deflected goal, offside goals standing...

:wtf?:

Admittedly, it was only when a sports psychologist spoke about it that I started to think in these terms. It's the only logical reason because we have tried everything that it is conceivable to try. 4-5-1, a more attacking line-up etc. I've read folk saying before that WGS's mistake was bringing Sheridan on. No, I don't think so! How many times have we tried to hold on to what we have as the clock is ticking down and been undone by a sucker punch? If that had happened, you can bet the same folk would have said we should have kept attacking. Well, we tried that and came close to getting a goal to kill them off. Then it went horribly wrong. :(

HAIL HAIL
:ynwa: Celtic in my heart, in my life, forever. :ynwa:

Caldwell.......McDonald.........VENNEGOOR OF HESSELINK :love: :pmsl:
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Henke
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There is no doubt that mentality plays a huge part, particularly when a team ends up with a monkey on their back such as this, or for example going through a long run of OF defeats.

That has played it's part under MON and now with GS, but I have to say that there is also a big lack of tactical understanding from both managers and both sets of players.

Away from home, you have to be tactically aware as a player. You have to be able to keep possession of the ball!!!!

THE most vital skill or ability that a team and individual players need to possess to win those difficult away ties.

It's about that, it's about being able to find a man with a pass, it's about to know when to make that run and when to not. It's about being vigilant when it comes to following your runners, etc, etc, etc....

We seriously lack these, simple some would say, skills. Both the managers and the players.

It is much different playing an away leg in a two leg knock out tie, compared to an away game in a mini League situation like the CL.

We have always been excellent in the old two leg affair, but it takes a different approach and understanding in what is essentially an away league match against much better opposition.

And that is a position that we are not too familiar being in. Whenever we play away from home in the SPL, we are the daddy's. The big bhoys. Away from home in the CL, that is not the case and it is a position and a change to our approach to a game, different from anything we are used to , that we have never reconciled ourselves with.

The attitude and mental approach needs to change, along with our actual approach to these games, for us to ever have a chance of breaking this duck.
In every hick town in Caledonia

Across this pseudo nation

You can see the most fucked up scum that was ever shat into creation

Where a blue McEwan's lager top equals no imagination

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If you're having cash problems I feel bad for you hun
I've got 99 problems but tax ain't one
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Roseanne
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Henke
Nov 29 2008, 12:21 AM
It is much different playing an away leg in a two leg knock out tie, compared to an away game in a mini League situation like the CL.

That is true. You only need to look at our run to Seville to see that. And our run in the following season's UEFA cup. Then there was the draw in the away game v Spartak as well, which gave us the advantage going into the game at CP. And, even though we lost, our last 16 away leg v Milan was, for me, our best away performance in the CL. We lost but we kept a clean sheet over 90 minutes and it was only a wonder goal from Kaka that separated us after extra time.

I'm convinced every time we go into an away CL game this will be the night. I will be the next time too. I can't imagine just how mental I'll go when we actually do win! :yikes: :D

HAIL HAIL
:ynwa: Celtic in my heart, in my life, forever. :ynwa:

Caldwell.......McDonald.........VENNEGOOR OF HESSELINK :love: :pmsl:
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tigergerry
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two very good posts from the two of you but i saw a wee contridiction of term
nothing personel here but ill take you first here henke
in the year that we got to seville against liverpool/blackburn /boavista we never won our home games
aw ay to liverpool /blackburn /boavista we did
also we beat stutgart at home and away were two nothing up and got beat
there is nothing to show a pattern here .as to rosie yes i think there is a physocological thing here some people call it a monkey on our back not as far as im concerned
over the last 4 years in th c.l it has been silly mistakes some early on some not

my imput to this is that it is a mixture of a lot of results in fixtures that it is the supporters that are having the problem
to sum this up
were you a liar to yourself that the huns backlog of fixtures last season didnt take its toll on them to our benefit
or are you glad that we are out of europe (not that i want to be but at the present moment of time any hun would have been glad if celtic qaulified for the E.U.F.A spot on tuesday) or at best won and then beat villareal on the 10th and we would still be in the champions league last 16 after xmas
priority is todays game good support to the team and a nother three points then onwards to 4 in a row and possibly a treble
no more distractions from now till the end of the season
then well take it from there
tigers gonna get ya
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Caesar
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Don't blame Peter Lawwell for Celtic's Champions League exit, says Gordon Strachan
Nov 29 2008 By Hugh Keevins

GORDON STRACHAN last night backed the Celtic board to the hilt and refused to blame them for the Champions League embarrassment against Aalborg.

Boss Strachan denied that lack of investment in the team might drive him away from the club, whether or not Celtic win four in a row.

Chief executive Peter Lawwell has been accused of bringing back the days of the 'Biscuit tin'.

But Strachan says he would rather have Celtic as they are than facing ruination in the credit crunch.

He said: "I look after the team and Peter looks after finances. I get on great with him and enjoy his company.

"English football is terrific at the moment where Europe's concerned but some of the clubs who are doing well could have a big problem with the credit crunch because of the money they owe.

"What do we owe? s3million. Celtic is as safe as houses and I'm happy to work with what I've got. I knew the deal when I took over as manager."

When it was pointed out to him that a healthy-looking balance sheet wasn't a trophy and the fans would turn on him if results weren't good, he stayed upbeat.

Strachan said: "I think I'm in a lucky position. We know we're not the greatest team in the world but I have finely balanced individual personalities in my squad and what follows on from Europe isn't a test of character for them. The hurt was huge on Tuesday but the wounds have gone."

Strachan's view of the state of Scottish football after 13 European ties involving five clubs yielded no wins was equally upbeat.

He said: "I read Andy Gray's comments in the Daily Record that it was unacceptable for Celtic to lose to Aalborg and Rangers to be eliminated from Europe by Kaunas.

"He's the best pundit in the business but I have to ask him if that means we should never beat Manchester United and Rangers should never get the results they got on the way to the UEFA Cup Final last season.

"I've been proud of Scottish football but things haven't gone as well for all of us this year. If my players want to listen to criticism that's come their way since Tuesday that's their business but the strongest voice is mine. And I say they've a lot to be proud of." Celtic have to lift themselves off the floor and hit back against Inverness Caley Thistle at home today.

Strachan reckons he won't need to coax a performance from his players to ensure they maintain their SPL lead over Rangers.

He said: "There's no preaching required because the players are first class. The management team have helped but they've done everything for themselves.

"I look beyond hysteria and ask how we're playing. My answer is we've got a lot going for us.

"Gary Caldwell had the disappointment of the own goal but I saw at him in training today and his spirit is part of the reason we're doing well."

The only cloud on the manager's horizon is Aiden McGeady's continuing injury problem.

He was taken to Denmark but couldn't even sit on the bench. Strachan said: "Aiden can have 15 minutes free from pain then his knee starts to get sore again. Doctors are going to have another look at him over the next couple of days.

"I can't speculate on whether he might need an operation because I'm not a medical man."

Strachan then shrugged off Artur Boruc's claim that he has no friends at Parkhead.

The Polish keeper reportedly made the comment in a magazine in his homeland.

Strachan said: "There are people who, once training is finished, like their own company.

"By the looks of it, he has far better people to mingle with than some of the lads that are here.

"So I can understand why he wants to down the tools and get out of here as quickly as possible."



Daily Rancid
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Henke
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Caesar
Nov 29 2008, 10:06 PM
GORDON STRACHAN last night backed the Celtic board to the hilt and refused to blame them for the Champions League embarrassment against Aalborg.


And that there, is why he will have the job for as long as he wants. :rolleyes:
In every hick town in Caledonia

Across this pseudo nation

You can see the most fucked up scum that was ever shat into creation

Where a blue McEwan's lager top equals no imagination

You're hunbelievable



If you're having cash problems I feel bad for you hun
I've got 99 problems but tax ain't one
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desachi
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Utterly childish to suggest that it to spend means us being in massive debt suffering in the credit crunch. It is precisely this type of thinking that has led us to where we are in terms of some of the chronic under investment in the side of late.

Simple, we failed to strengthen areas of the side and that has cost us. The league set up (albeit a mini league) is designed to allow quality to rise to the top, thereby eliminating the "freak" result. Quality will rise, and we have failed to increase on that during the summer.

As for the injury crisis argument, that is fair enough, but strengthening might have meant having the luxury of bringing someone like a half fit Samaras off the bench as opposed to Sheridan who looked a fish out of water (completely understandable). Would have meant us not having to rely on Ben Hutchinson for the game against Man Utd at CP when we needed someone who could keep the ball up front.

Living with our heads in the sand about this will produce no change. We must look to strengthen all the time and not use the excuse of money. No excuses, understanding sure, but surely the fact that in the last three and a half years we have signed only one left back and spent £2.5 million on 3 centre halves (all of which have proved themselves inadequate at CL level for the most part) speaks volumes here.

Steven Pressley (an unbelievable signing considering he kept out Balde and O'Dea), Gary Caldwell (fair enough, improving though he has taken his sweet time about it and is probably playing at the top of his game but will never get faster, and never get good in the air) and Glen Loovens (potential and will need time). :rolleyes:
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Mainser
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I would say I am staggered, but that would be a lie - the fact is that we are moving into the slow lane as MON put it. I am pretty sanguine about it to be frank. The MON years were superb, as were the Stein years, albeit not really in my memory, but with those exceptions (and the 90's on the flipside) we are back to the natural state of Celtic equilibrium of competitive on the domestic front and the occassional good run in Europe - pretty much like the mid 70's until 1989.

I am not saying it's right, it just seems to be the way the board and the White's etc ran our club - some other people are using an entirely appropriate word - ambition!

It could always be worse, we could be Huns!
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