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| Abortion V2 | |
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| Topic Started: May 1 2008, 12:41 AM (220 Views) | |
| Ilex | May 1 2008, 12:41 AM Post #1 |
Hillary '08!
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What're your views on abortion? DEBATE AWAY. I am pro-choice. I believe that a woman should have the choice to abort on the condition that she is sterilized from having future pregnancies. Either take a pregnancy or take none at all, a baby is not a pick-and-choose option. Even if it's rape, why should you pass the punishment onto a developing human? And it's not her 'body', it has completely separate DNA from her. |
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| drake fang | May 1 2008, 08:07 AM Post #2 |
Forum Teenager
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I am against abortion because, well, just because someone can't take care of the baby that doesn't mean they should kill it and take away its chance of living here. I think that's just wrong. :( |
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| Shed | May 1 2008, 01:57 PM Post #3 |
Don't go in the Shed!
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I am in favor of legal (preferably cheap) abortion, but without conditions. Maybe the pregnancy was an accident; the woman (or the couple) isn't ready for a child yet, but may come to be in the future. If they can't take proper care of the kid as is, they should be allowed to not have it, or else many people will suffer. But if they later decide they can take good care of the baby, then why not allow them? With proper family planning, everything is better. I'm all for proper family planning. |
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| Ilex | May 1 2008, 04:03 PM Post #4 |
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Hillary '08!
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I lolled when I read that. She shouldn't be having sex before she is ready to have children, or should use better protection to prevent conception. A developing human is not worth being killed because the Mom was being stupid.
This is why there is adoption, just because you don't want to have a baby, doesn't mean that it's okay not to. If you aren't ready, give it up to adoption and save yourself the surgery. 'Proper family planning'? If the Mom/Dad of the fetus knew anything about planning good, they would've taken more precaution. And in the scenario where they took precaution and it happened anyway, too bad. Here's a news flash: Sex was intended to get people pregnant. When you have sex, you're taking the risk of getting pregnant and should be expecting it. And if you don't want a kid, go for adoption and save the human life and surgery. And here's another thing that irks me: Abortion is covered on their Healthcare (In Canada). So pretty much every time I pay taxes I'm helping a stupid woman kill her child. If that's not wrong I don't know what is. I mean, if you're going to kill your baby you should at least have to pay for it. |
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| EternalEbony | May 1 2008, 05:48 PM Post #5 |
I See Dead Laptops...
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Well, I say yes, but only if it's Rape. And only if it's very early in the pregnancy. If you're too lazy to use protection, and end up pregnant, it's your fault, you shouldn't be able to get an easy abortion. But if somebody rapes you, you might not be ready to have a child at all, and even if you put it for adoption, the foster care system probably won't be a pleasant experience for the child. And say a 16 year old girl is raped and ends up pregnant. She's very young, and probably not ready to handle the stress of pregnancy. If she gets an abortion, she should be able to get pregnant later, once she's older and able to handle parenting, etc. |
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| Ilex | May 1 2008, 05:59 PM Post #6 |
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Hillary '08!
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She may have been raped, but why should she pass on the punishment onto an innocent? You can't kill an innocent baby for doing nothing. And they've done studies and found that a lot of girls are more traumatized from having an abortion than they are from having a teen pregnancy. Lemme find an article. |
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| Shed | May 1 2008, 07:19 PM Post #7 |
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Don't go in the Shed!
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Ilex, I'm thinking overpopulation here. With careful family planning, we don't get overpopulation; if the pregnancy is an accident, we end up with both overpopulation and poverty. (Generalizations in place, of course.) Why shouldn't people have responsible sex before they are ready to have children? Wouldn't you have sex for pleasure? And contraception methods can fail even when they are correctly used, so there is an accident possibility. Imagine this. You're pregnant, but you don't want a kid. Would you rather go through nine months of suffering to give the child up for adoption, or just have an abortion and have maybe a month recovering from the surgery? I'm sure you'd prefer the latter. Plus, if you go for the former, you're still adding an unwanted child into the world. Lastly, sure, sex was made to create offspring. (Coincidentally I'm listening to the Offspring as I write this.) BUT, in all other species they have a number of children that is just enough to replace their parents and maintain the species alive. They may have very few children because they don't die all that often (eg. lions), or on the other end of the spectrum, they have an infinity of children because they have few chances at survival (eg. sea turtles). Humans, however, have no predators, are very adaptive and still have more kids than they should. |
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| Ilex | May 1 2008, 07:45 PM Post #8 |
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Hillary '08!
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The areas with access to abortion are very rarely the areas with overpopulation. Nigeria is one of the most rapidly populating countries in the world. Yet I bet you that over 90% of people there cannot afford abortions. They don't even have birth control methods a lot of the time in the first place. But here in the Western World, overpopulation is not an issue. There is no point for abortion here other than selfishness. I see sex as a taking a chance, you're trying to enjoy it without actually follow its purpose. And if it does follow its purpose, too bad, you should have been expecting that. Condom failure is quite low, it works 98% of the time. This is where I think morals come in. Going through 9 months of pregnancy is better than killing an innocent human. Even if the child is unwanted, at least it isn't dead. Again, the ones having the most kids and the ones able to abort are on opposite sides of the world. The reason people in 3rd world countries have more kids is to acquire more labour to surive, just like animals. Here people only have like 2-3 kids so overpopulation isn't an issue. |
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| 3d | May 1 2008, 11:00 PM Post #9 |
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Chicken Xing
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Well, I guess my opinion on abortion is null. I'm not against or for abortion. :/ I believe it should be completely up to the parent whether they want to abort it or keep it. As said before rape is a good example for abortion. Though there are arguments against it, I'm sure if you were in the position of a raped girl who got pregnant, you would want to have an abortion too. Another good example is health issues. If you and/or your baby are at risk of dying from child birth or you may transfer a lethal disease to it wouldn't you rather abort it than have it die in your arms or have a miscarriage? And Ilex, most abortions take place in the first trimester of pregnancy. Usually when having an abortion your "baby" is a mass of developing cells. I wouldn't really call that a human life, but I guess some people might. :/ I don't really care much for the topic of abortion, but I think if you have the right reasons, laws shouldn't stop you from doing it. |
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| DDR Master | May 2 2008, 12:50 AM Post #10 |
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Forum Baby
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I have pretty big views on abortion. I had to do a debate on this for a sixth grade project. I view a fetus as a non-living organism (if there is a such thing) and therefore it cannot feel pain. Although the parent may or may not want a child, if they were raped or had underage, they should have the right to have an abortion. As well as this, I wouldn't consider adoption because when you think about it, there are all those children who were adopted and depressed because they don't get to spend very much time with their biological parents. I say that if people just had abortions people wouldn't be as depressed. Also, many children in Africa are starving. If people had abortions that would decrease the amount of people on the earth by at least ten million. If this happens, all this food and medication can go to children in Africa who truly need some things for them. In seventh grade we had something in health class where we had to vote on values. One of them was "A minor should be allowed to have an abortion without telling their parents". I am for this because if a minor is uncomfortable about having sex or if they were raped they would not have to tell their parents and they'd be happy afterwards. |
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| Ilex | May 2 2008, 01:19 AM Post #11 |
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Hillary '08!
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Let me reveal you the 4 requirements for something to be a living organism: - It must have a way of acquiring energy. Fetuses acquire energy from their mother through the umbilical cord. -It must produce waste. Yes, Fetuses produce waste. -Must be able to respond to its surroundings. Ever watch a pregnant woman's stomach move up and down from the fetus? Fetuses have all their senses developed in just a few months - It must be able to reproduce. Not yet, but neither can children. But since its cells are dividing constantly, it is reproducing in a way. A fetus is clearly alive, so your theory autofails.
My sister is adopted, and she's known it since she was a toddler and is in no way depressed. She is as happy as any other 10-year old.
Can you please provide a citation for this fact you found? And it seems like you are more pro-abortion than you are pro-choice. I bet you that the western world could feed all the children in Africa on our own without killing any more humans, we over consume as it is. |
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| EternalEbony | May 2 2008, 05:23 PM Post #12 |
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I See Dead Laptops...
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This is why I see abortion as not as bad as some people. Sure, killing a young fetus is destroying what could be a successful human life. So is menstruation, and you don't see girls crying over the egg cell they just lost, since it could've grown into a baby if it had been fertilized and all. If these women do exist, they're a bit... odd. I just don't see a very underdeveloped fetus as having the same value as a normal human life, although I don't see it as not having value at all. Edit: Sure, menstruation is natural, abortions aren't, but still. Both are, if you look at it a certain way, "baby killing". And either way, although some adopted children live normal lives, some might not be adopted for a while, and that could be stressful on them. |
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| drake fang | May 2 2008, 06:12 PM Post #13 |
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Forum Teenager
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For the cases where the mother purposely had underage and wasn't intending to get pregnant, I totally agree with Failex in every way. If the mother was irresponsible enough to have underage, then why kill a developing human because of something that was your fault? |
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| Ilex | May 2 2008, 06:18 PM Post #14 |
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Hillary '08!
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You cannot compare menstruation or masturbation to abortion. Sperm and ovum cells have only half a set of DNA, cannot reproduce and are just half-produced clones of their host human. A fetus however, has its own DNA, making it separate from the mother (Which is why it isn't her body), it's own personality, body etcetera. |
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| 3d | May 2 2008, 06:43 PM Post #15 |
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Chicken Xing
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The fact still remains that in most states/countries, you can only get an abortion during the first trimester. In the first trimester the baby resembles a human infant, but it doesn't look like one. The fetus doesn't even start developing brain processes, move, or produce waste, urinate, till the secong trimester. Its still alive, but I wouldn't classify it as a functioning human being, but more as a mass of growing cells. Of course this all just my opinion. :/ |
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| Silfa | May 2 2008, 10:43 PM Post #16 |
Admiral Awesome
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This is where "Fetuses have all their senses developed in just a few months" fails as a requirement. This means that the fetus has not met all the requirements to be a lving organism, no? Most of what I've seen people saying is they agree with it during the first trimester, which means the fetus hasn't reached the stage where it has developed senses. So your theory autofails. For the whole "She may have been raped, but why should she pass on the punishment onto an innocent?, how on earth can use innocence as an argument? You seem to have conveniently left out the fact that the woman who was subject to the rape was innocent herself. Why should an innocent woman (a woman who didn't ask for this child in no way at all) be punished with an unwanted 9 months of pregnancy? There's also the pain this woman has to go threw and how she could possibly be emotionally torn apart when she has to this child away. Innocent women should not be punished because of some vile male's actions. |
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| Penguin | May 3 2008, 10:15 AM Post #17 |
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Well, he's a platypus. They don't do much.
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I think it should be acceptable only if birth would kill the mother, and I believe if rape occurs, it should be given up for adoption. I know the mother has to go through 9 months of pregnancy and birth, but there should be harsher punishments for rape as well, I think. |
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