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- After playing through Sticker Star, I realized something
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| After playing through Sticker Star, I realized something | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Nov 26 2012, 10:02 PM (629 Views) | |
| Master Egil | Nov 26 2012, 10:02 PM Post #1 |
Goomba
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I didn't like it. In fact, I was more disappointed with this game than SPM. The only story in the game existed in the opening and closing cutscenes, none of the worlds have their own unique themes or stories we're mostly familiar with, really everything we love about the series is absent from this title. I never thought it was possible, but the game has sacrificed all story for gameplay...in an RPG. You don't even level up anymore, you gain HP Hearts which increase your max HP by doing sidequests and finding them around the levels. And since Miyamoto himself wants little story in any Mario game, we can kiss any chance of another Paper Mario goodbye. I can't play this series if it doesn't have a story going with it. And yes, it's a Mario game, but it's also an RPG. It didn't stop SMRPG, the first Paper Mario, M&L, TTYD, M&L2, SPM, and BIS from having stories. I was actually depressed by SPM's ending when I first saw it. Oh well, RIP Mario RPG Storylines: 1996-2012 |
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| Pyroll7 | Nov 26 2012, 10:19 PM Post #2 |
Dark Samus
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BIS is actually similar to Sticker Star when it comes to story. There wasn't as much to the story compared to the first to M&L games. Sticker Star doesn't have a good story I agree, for one thing, what the fuck is Bowser doing through the whole game. Haven't seen Bowser at all really. But........if you only play Paper Mario for it's story that's kinda sad. I actually like Paper Mario first for it's gameplay and at the same time, the older games, had fantastic stories. I think that Sticker Star does have good gameplay except for the battle, it's not better than the first two games, I know, but it still has some good gameplay. I recently played through the original and TTYD before playing Sticker Star and the one thing about Sticker Star is that you are doing more in this game in terms of gameplay compared to TTYD. TTYD is still better than Sticker Star but TTYD had parts where you didn't do much and it focused more on the story, for example, the fighting arena. The whole time you're just being told to go do this and you do it, the train as well is basically just story, more so than the arena even. Also, the parts where you are doing more gameplay are actually pretty short in TTYD. TTYD is the one that focuses on story the most, the first game is a good mix of both and Sticker Star focuses more on the gameplay and not really on the story at all. (I haven't play SPM recently, so I won't comment on that one.) |
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| Master Egil | Nov 26 2012, 10:42 PM Post #3 |
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Goomba
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SPM easily had the most story out of all of them, and for that I was able to forgive it's otherwise putrid gameplay. Sticker Star was the total opposite where it was more gameplay and less story. As I said, I'm aware this is a Mario game, but it still needs to have some story rather than have five minutes at the the start and not seen again until the end. Maybe I set my expectations too high, I don't know. I was aware what Sticker Star was going to be, and I hoped it would be something more. It wasn't. It lacked the charm, dialogue, and colorful cast we've come to know from the games prior to it. Do I want it to be like SPM's detail? Not really, the game was darker than what Mario should be. TTYD had the RPG element down perfectly, yet not every party member contributed to the main storyline in some way. And no I don't play Paper Mario only for the story. I bought TTYD and got back into the series for the gameplay. The story didn't mean a damn until I got older and saw plotlines I didn't know of. I'm just saying you can't have a good RPG without a decent story. But like with every other thing he does, I guess Mario is the exception. |
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| VelvetLightning | Nov 26 2012, 11:36 PM Post #4 |
Princess of Pink.
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I guess i'm biased on the topic, but i loved all the Paper Mario games. The first one is always my favorite, be it for nostalgic factor or for the balance the game had in comparison to the later titles. The second game was just what i think i would ever ask for in a sequel in the series, very similar in the first game that it could rightfully be called a successor but at the same time, very different and enjoyable. Super Paper Mario for me was an excellent game in it's own right. Was it a good Paper Mario game? No. But it was a fun and interesting game that i thoroughly enjoyed on many different levels. I may be in the minority for that one, but either way, i loved it. Sticker Star, for me, is a good game. Maybe not a great game but similar to my views on SPM, it's a bad Paper Mario game, but a good game on it's own. Paper Mario is not a series you play for the RPG factor, so i wouldn't ever head into a newer game expecting something in that sense. But i found the interesting pros of the game outweighed the cons. That somehow kept it from being a bad game for me. I do wish they would make a game in the same way they made the first Paper Mario, but at the same time, i'm more than content with replaying it over and over everytime i need my fix. |
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| Togeshroob | Nov 27 2012, 08:46 PM Post #5 |
(Temporarily closed. ...Gwaargh!) *doo wee doo wee doo*
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Oh quit whining about story being dead; the only reason Sticker Star doesn't have much story is because it's a handheld game. I don't know why people didn't see this coming. Handheld games are not (or at least probably should not be) made with a long, sub-plot-filled story in mind. Otherwise they might as well be console games! Handheld consoles are designed with 'on-the-go' play in mind, not 'devote-hours-at-a-time-and-get-super-involved-in-the-world' play, and that only makes sense. Some people (like myself, I'll admit!) ONLY play handheld games with super devotion, but I don't think that playing ONE game that was designed to have no story should destroy one's faith in a franchise, or more importantly, in a company. I think it's a right and proper design philosophy for a handheld game. Maybe they just should have used a different franchise, or something :p You'll get your story when the next console RPG comes out :] (Incidentally, the 'on-the-go' design mentality greatly accounts for the nature of recent handheld Zelda games. These games make a whole lot more sense when viewed from this perspective.) |
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| VelvetLightning | Nov 28 2012, 12:57 PM Post #6 |
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Princess of Pink.
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While i agree this title and even SPM shouldn't be a reason to give up on the series, i can see why people wouldn't like this game. It's understandable. But at the same time i wouldn't say all handheld games are meant to be pick up and play games. Obviously, a ton are; but out of the thousands of handheld games throughout the span of console gaming a great portion are time consuming/story driven/in depth games. You can't give the makers of Sticker Star an excuse that it should have been an on the go title because it was on a handheld console. They easily could have made a separate mode with leveling, more ways to upgrade Mario, and maybe even harder battles with double the difficulty. These things were overlooked to appeal to non-RPG players and i get the tactic. Still it's not cause to alienate the core fans who buy their games for the "Paper Mario" style they want. I think with a "classic" mode or "hardcore" mode the game could have been a title meant for both old and new players of the series. This game had much more potential than SPM did to be a great Paper Mario game, but even though they didn't take that route, it's by no means a horrible game. It's just not what everyone wanted. |
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| Pyroll7 | Nov 28 2012, 09:31 PM Post #7 |
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Dark Samus
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This game was targeted to a new audience. It's like Nintendo is sneaking in casual aspects into their once hardcore games. I think the jrpg level up system in general is dead. Like I said, I think this game was targeted for a new audience. A lot of people who didn't grow up with jrpgs on the NES or the SNES just don't like the jrpg level system. Some do, some don't, some liked it when playing the original Paper Mario but in general there is just a lot of people today who don't like the jrpg style rpg. Edited by Pyroll7, Nov 28 2012, 09:34 PM.
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| LK | Nov 28 2012, 09:43 PM Post #8 |
iminspace
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I'm not a big fan of Sticker Star, either. My two biggest gripes are not getting anything for winning battles (like an XP system seen in the previous three games) and the bizarre solutions to sticker puzzles that sometimes make absolutely no sense. I don't think the boss fights are very fun, either. I think I mentioned it before but I don't feel as if the game has much personality. It feels very shallow and empty. The first games had such great dialog and atmosphere. The world felt alive. Sticker Star feels the opposite. |
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| IceCatraz | Nov 29 2012, 02:30 PM Post #9 |
Roar of Mufasa
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I think it's rather silly to call this game, or SPM a bad "Paper Mario" game. What makes a Paper Mario game a Paper Mario game? Before anything, it's the visual style, followed by the writing and dialogue, then the perky, off key music, and then the battle system. So because one aspect isn't the same as the first two in the series, it's not a good Paper Mario title? That's insanely absurd. Look at other games - the first two Fallout titles (in the main series) are Point and Click action titles. The latter two, Fallout 3 and New Vegas, are free roaming RPGs, with a completely different battle system than the first two. Are 3 and New Vegas any less Fallout titles than the first two? Look at the Mario titles. Super Mario 1, 2, and 3 are all side scrolling titles, while Mario 64, Sunshine, and Galaxy are 3D platformers. Does that make them any less of a Mario title? Breaking it down more specifically, many claim this title (and SPM) not to be Paper Mario titles because of the battle system. Let's look at Fallout again. If Fallout 4 lacked the V.A.T.S system, but retained everything from the former title (in a similar way that Sticker Star lacks a level up system but retains the basic battle flow from TTYD) - does that make it any less of a Fallout title? No. What makes a Fallout Title is the world, the writing, the art style (which is consistent throughout all of the Fallout titles), the music, and the lore itself. The same is certainly true for both Super Paper Mario and this title. The game may play differently, but it's still a Paper Mario games because it has everything that actually makes it a Paper Mario game. @Togeshroob - I actually don't agree. I think mechanically, handheld games are designed to be pick up and play (frequent save points, suspending saves, etc), but I've played a great deal of indepth, plot twisting hand held games that rival that of console titles. I don't think using the "it was designed to be played on the go" excuse is much of a valid excuse for not including a story, or including a very lack luster story. That being said, from what I've played, I do think this game has a story, and I think it's told very well. The dialogue is just as well as previous Paper Mario titles (the fact that everyone knows they are made of paper only furthers this), the story telling just as well (just far less cinematic, which I dig), and the atmosphere is much more Paper like, which I can see being an up or down for some people. |
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| Pyroll7 | Nov 29 2012, 08:41 PM Post #10 |
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Dark Samus
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I don't mind the story. The others had better and really good stories but Sticker Star still has an entertaining story. The story mostly consists of toads and what they are doing while Bowser hides out in his castle like a coward but it's still an entertaining story. I wonder how someone could not consider this a Paper Mario game though, the gameplay still screams Paper Mario even with the battle system it has. Edited by Pyroll7, Nov 29 2012, 08:44 PM.
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| LK | Nov 29 2012, 08:47 PM Post #11 |
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iminspace
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@Ice: Your analogy is completely valid, but the problem I have with it is that Fallout 3 and Fallout: New Vegas are great games. Super Paper Mario and Sticker Star... aren't. I don't care for them, anyways. |
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| IceCatraz | Nov 29 2012, 08:55 PM Post #12 |
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Roar of Mufasa
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I suppose that's debatable depending on the person. I suppose the analogy can be taken to any series that made similar jumps with questionable outcomes - Pokemon Ruby and Sapphire to Pokemon Coliseum, for example. It lacks certain aspects that the handheld titles have, but it's still very much a Pokemon title. Or more drastic, the Pokemon Color titles to the Mystery Dungeon titles. The Dungeon titles vary greatly in gameplay, but everything else makes it a Pokemon title - the writing, the style, the music, the atmosphere the..er, pokemon, etc. As for the other things - I dunno. I liked all of the Paper Mario titles thus far. |
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| Pyroll7 | Nov 29 2012, 09:00 PM Post #13 |
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Dark Samus
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I wouldn't really say that SPM and Sticker Star aren't great games. I think they're are both great games in their own way, two very creative games. Even though I like the first two better I still think the latter two are still really good games. Edited by Pyroll7, Nov 29 2012, 09:13 PM.
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| VelvetLightning | Nov 30 2012, 11:47 AM Post #14 |
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Princess of Pink.
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^Agreed. I love all of the Paper Mario titles - just some more than others. |
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| Master Egil | Nov 30 2012, 07:07 PM Post #15 |
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Goomba
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What makes this a "bad" Paper Mario is that the only Paper Mario feel from it is the fact that Mario is paper. The writing and dialogue was cringe worthy. More bad paper puns in this game than bad dog puns in Rover Dangerfield. Music is okay at best, but I get an odd vibe of Shoji Meguro from the final boss theme. What made the 3D Mario games good was the fact that effort was put into them. A large 3D world with end goals was needed to make the games work. They perfectly kept the Mario feel because of the characters, platforming, levels, music, and of course Toads. They even added new characters along the way, all while retaining Mario's jumping and fun platforming, changing it slightly with each game. This one however changes pretty much everything. Gone is the humor I once loled at, gone are the partners who spoke for Mario and had great personalities, gone is most of the music I used to love (exceptions being the final battles), gone is a battle system that doesn't rely on making Mario forget he has real life shoes and a hammer, gone is a save feature that doesn't hold your hand the whole game through, I could go on. There isn't even a save block in the final dungeon. If I wanted to walk to the final boss, I would just get Final Fantasy IV and go through four floors of pointlessness. I normally do not get that picky of a game, but they took out stuff I honest to God thought they would never remove. I swear, it felt more like a fangame than anything else. Oh, and there are suggestions that this formula will stay for future Paper Mario games. If that happens, I'll just cry. |
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