| Welcome to Europeia! So what the heck is Europeia anyways? Can I join? So, I came here representing another region? I do not want to become a citizen. Where should I go? What offices are there for people to be elected into? What is there for me to do in Europeia? That answers most of my immediate questions. What if I have any more? |
| The Original EAAC Debate | |
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| Topic Started: Jul 2 2014, 03:23 AM (405 Views) | |
| Rach | Jul 2 2014, 03:23 AM Post #1 |
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At Least 5% Sugar
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Prior to the formation of the EAAC, it was called the EAC. A committee started when Earth22 was elected as President in early 2011 on a suggestion from North East Somerset whom she had made a part of her Foreign Affairs team. However, during my first term things came to a head when the foreign minister at the time announced the EAC in public. This was when the EAC went from a quiet and not well understood Foreign Affairs project to becoming the more official and legal EAAC and becoming a major policy debate. The original debate over the EAC is here: http://s6.zetaboards.com/Europeia/topic/1267144/1/. The eventual outcome and compromise was the establishment of the EAAC via EO. |
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♥ Love and Kindness are never wasted ♥ The 2011 President of the Year Queen of Balder Unofficial Navy Girl | |
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| Kraketopia | Jul 2 2014, 03:56 AM Post #2 |
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Very interesting stuff. |
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| modernsin | Jul 2 2014, 04:08 AM Post #3 |
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Yeah, I'm not reading through all that. I don't want 9 more pages of Earth being a petulant asshole burned in my memory.The general language and tone of the debate was veeery 2010-2011 though. Maybe that's partly why it's so unpleasant to read through. |
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CV Accolades
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| Anumia | Jul 2 2014, 01:13 PM Post #4 |
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Anumia Novo Spiritus
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I have only ever walked out on Europeia once. It was after that thread. For the record, before I made the announcement public, I had had a long argument with Earth on MSN about it. First she was joking about it, trying to keep things light but say that the EAC shouldn't exist etc. Then she tried cajoling, and convincing. When I established that I was not going to agree with her, she turned nasty, and swiftly her primary reason for opposing the EAC was clear: it was NES' idea, and she hated NES, and wanted anything of his destroyed. She said she would go to a certain media service in existence at the time to "expose" the EAC and what-have-you to begin a public dialogue the result of which she intended would be the end of the EAC. I jumped the gun on her by beginning that thread. What is bitterly amusing is the hypocrisy of some who had been aware of its existence for some time - like Earth herself, in whose term it was created - and stayed silent until it suited them to make waves about it. Apparently the great crime was on Rachel and I, for having not announced its existence until approximately two weeks (I think) into her term; meanwhile, it being created during Earth's term without any public notice whatsoever for a couple of months thereafter was apparently totally okay. I know not -everyone- agrees with this narrative, but given that around this time Earth and co. were in the process of leaving Europeia essentially for good, and trying to do us damage on the international stage, it is fairly clear to my mind that aside from the personal vendetta Earth had against NES and his brainchild, there was a desire to weaken our ability to craft our long-term foreign policy. To whit: our international position today (excepting our WA clout which is primarily thanks to a few specific citizens like MD, Mouse, and Vinage) owes the overwhelming majority of its stability and significance to the long-term work of the EAAC and its membership; the potential would have already been foreseeable back then, and had Earth succeeded in bringing down the EAC, I can state with absolute confidence that we would not be as important, as well-connected, or as well-respected internationally as we are. I hope that anyone who chooses to read through that thread can thus understand why I am reticent to open the potential for having to deal with that again, and why I may have a rather short fuse on the subject. |
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| hyanygo | Jul 2 2014, 02:23 PM Post #5 |
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It's clear to anyone that Earth didn't like NES, and for good reason* (I am in the possession of some illuminating private IRC conversations). *In that is obvious to she why she didn't like him and it makes sense given the characters. Edited by hyanygo, Jul 2 2014, 02:24 PM.
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| modernsin | Jul 2 2014, 03:02 PM Post #6 |
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She didn't like most people who called her out or otherwise argued with her about anything, ever. |
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| hyanygo | Jul 2 2014, 03:30 PM Post #7 |
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No, you could call her out you just didn't have to be a little d--k (which discounts most of NS and present company) about it. |
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| modernsin | Jul 2 2014, 03:44 PM Post #8 |
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As I mentioned earlier, she was a dick in plenty of debates. Usually she'd start out okay, then her attitude would gradually devolve as she slowly realized that her arguments weren't changing the minds of whomever she was arguing against. At one point she called all NCPers "bullies" while conveniently 'forgetting' that her behavior during the nadir of the NCP/Old Guard era (Falc vs Rougiers election) was as bad as anyone else's. I've read plenty of stuff from 2011 when Earth's thundercuntery was at an all-time high, and much of her behavior during that time didn't really merit a civil response. Probably a good thing I wasn't around then.
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| Common-Sense Politics | Jul 2 2014, 04:38 PM Post #9 |
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Incapable of Bullshit
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*shuts mouth I just can't afford to have a blood pressure explosion argument with you people every day and the "everybody gets a trophy" horseshit in the CA already has me heated.
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The Venerable Imperator Common-Sense Politics, ER ESE EBS EOB EC ES OR1-4 Father to McEntire Chancellory Decorations Presidential Decorations Resume References
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| Lethen | Jul 2 2014, 11:15 PM Post #10 |
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Remember when I was famous? Neither do I.
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Interesting stuff, though I didn't bother reading through most of it this time around. |
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me, basically (click) A letter to a friend By the Prophetical Blessing of Nethel, Supreme Chancellor of the Republic of Europeia and the states within, Destined Overseer of His rightful yet forgotten realms of Estalcia and Old Europe and Crystal Falls, Defender of the Faith and New Jersey, and Heir to the concept of Sarcasm | |
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| Rach | Jul 2 2014, 11:37 PM Post #11 |
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At Least 5% Sugar
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It's long and pretty nasty stuff
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♥ Love and Kindness are never wasted ♥ The 2011 President of the Year Queen of Balder Unofficial Navy Girl | |
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| Cormac | Jul 3 2014, 03:33 AM Post #12 |
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Awesomesauce
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Cormac wonders if it is in fact possible to have a thread here involving discussion of Earth in which the c-word is not used... Regardless, it was an interesting read. It seems that many of the arguments made for and against the EAC at its inception are the same arguments we're seeing today. This isn't the first time I've seen such debate either, as I remember an abbreviated argument on the subject happening when I was first active here in 2012. I wonder if it might not behoove us to give the EAAC a solid legislative foundation -- even if it's just legislating the status quo -- as giving it more firm roots in our law might stop the annual debates. Out of curiosity, has anyone ever proposed Senate confirmation of EAAC members? That may alleviate some of the often repeated concerns. |
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Cormac Skollvaldr Vincit qui patitur (He conquers who endures) | |
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| Anumia | Jul 3 2014, 03:40 AM Post #13 |
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Anumia Novo Spiritus
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Do we have to legislate the Office of Embassies and Ambassadors? The Culture Planning Subforum? The Altitude Room? |
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| Drecq | Jul 3 2014, 03:47 AM Post #14 |
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EMPEROR OF THAT PLACE OVER THERE, RULER OF THINGS AND PEOPLES, BREEZEBORN, MOTHER OF LIZARDS
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More importantly, if we start making sub-cabinet posts senate confirmable should we make them all confirmable or only the ones people dont understand arent anywhere as powerful as they believe? |
The Ven. Drecq ER ES ES ESH EEQ EED OR4 OR3 WE3![]() ![]() ![]() Presidential Awards Current Positions Past Positions
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| Cormac | Jul 3 2014, 03:51 AM Post #15 |
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Awesomesauce
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That's a valid point, and as you know I'm not one of the people who is in favor of changing or eliminating the EAAC. I've defended it in the recent past. To bring up one of the more valid points made in 2011, though, the difference between those subforums and the EAAC is that any citizen can if they choose to do so join the ministries with which they are associated and access those forums (at least the first two, I'll have to confess I don't know what the third is). That is not the case with the EAAC, which is in my view the cause of the controversy surrounding it. On the other hand, we do have other subforums such as Tomlinson and the Navy command subforum(s?) that are not in any way accessible to ordinary citizens and these are not legislated. I'm personally fine with leaving the EAAC as it is, without legislation. The reason I suggest legislation is to avoid these arguments that so many are clearly so tired of having. If the EAAC is legislated -- particularly if taken to the People in referendum, where I'm confident it would pass, perhaps with a few modest changes -- maybe we won't have to have this annual debate. |
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Cormac Skollvaldr Vincit qui patitur (He conquers who endures) | |
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I don't want 9 more pages of Earth being a petulant asshole burned in my memory.








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