| Welcome to Europeia! So what the heck is Europeia anyways? Can I join? So, I came here representing another region? I do not want to become a citizen. Where should I go? What offices are there for people to be elected into? What is there for me to do in Europeia? That answers most of my immediate questions. What if I have any more? |
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| Topic Started: May 19 2014, 05:38 PM (525 Views) | |
| Lethen | May 20 2014, 04:16 AM Post #31 |
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Remember when I was famous? Neither do I.
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I make exceptions.
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me, basically (click) A letter to a friend By the Prophetical Blessing of Nethel, Supreme Chancellor of the Republic of Europeia and the states within, Destined Overseer of His rightful yet forgotten realms of Estalcia and Old Europe and Crystal Falls, Defender of the Faith and New Jersey, and Heir to the concept of Sarcasm | |
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| Anumia | May 20 2014, 09:38 AM Post #32 |
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Anumia Novo Spiritus
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It's like no-one remembers the shit Earth, and others, went through. It's like no-one noticed how Henry went off the deep end after he was in politics here. I think very few noticed or listened when even I said it was getting to me; hell, I left during the resurgence of dickishness in 2011. Sopo left too, for a time, as did HEM, and Rachel kind of burned out and went elsewhere for ages. Abbey left too. All good, hard-working people, who actually served in Government instead of serving themselves in "opposition". I think it is extremely easy when you're the one being the opposition, when you're the one being the dick to people, to say "oh yes this is so very necessary, oh indeed rather quite, such a good thing to be 'challenging' our governments". Bloody easy to complain; very difficult to actually do something useful for once. Simply put: robust discussion and good political challenges come from people who not only have solutions instead of just pointing out problems, but are also willing to roll up their sleeves and do something about it. If the usual suspects decide to bitch and moan, and tell us they're doing the region a service without actually doing anything, I call bullshit. You know what's amazing about these two candidates? They're not nasty, they're not taking shots at each other. They're conducting civilised, decent campaigns, and I believe therefore that whoever loses will be decent to the winner thereafter, and actually work to help them in their term, instead of being a meaningless critic. Why anyone would want to go back to the bad old days is beyond me - and I say this in the full knowledge that I was pretty much unanimously popular (certainly more popular than today) during the NCP era - even Falconias couldn't really say much against me as I opposed him, decently.
This is indicative of the negativity. I say we have two solid candidates, ready, enthusiastic, and willing to take up the reins and move Europeia forward, but because they are both good, the race is close, which should make things exciting. Indeed, if the electorate was so unenthused, why were there so many votes in such a short time period? Surely an apathetic electorate wouldn't bother much with polling. Instead, however, you suggest a negative view of the situation without really having any basis for such, because it suits the narrative that our political culture is somehow weak in your view.
Yeah, isn't it shocking that after a large amount of the internal division and fighting was resolved/quelled, we actually started to make more of our region, especially on the world stage? For all the "glory" of the fighting in early 2010, we were something of a joke internationally. It was only as we matured and began thinking in the long term instead of sniping at one another that we were able to make consistent, solid gains.
In a nutshell, with Zenny, I pointed her at the goalposts, and let her make her own way there, with input but not micromanagement when necessary. She has done marvelously as my Culture Minister with that approach, and will be an asset to any future Cabinet.
This. Just. This. (bold emphasis mine, but the whole quote is spot on) Maybe it's more fun for those being critical to see the fights, but for those putting in the harder work, it's not exactly fun to do that and then get shit on in the game of "political discourse". If you want to be a serious competitor and present your own ideas and assert why your way is better, fine. Don't just seek to find fault and do nothing else.
I'd like to see you running, then. Maybe properly, instead of "I'll get elected for being lazy lol". I know that you are more than capable of being an energetic, intelligent Senator if you want to get involved there again; you're no fool, and can bring alternative ideas to the table. I might not agree with these ideas personally, but at least putting your own forward is better than just complaining about the status quo.
Oh good. This is called being part of the solution!
Has it ever occurred to you that perhaps your approach might be wrong? I have had plenty of conversations with plenty of people about plenty of things, and if they're not, say, going to start with "Foreign Affairs Seem Foreign to Anumia Administration" (lolbecausetwoalliancesandbeingastakeholderintheOFOistotalfailureinternationally), I or whoever is being criticised might respond a bit more readily. Put simply, if you're full of crap, or going to come out swinging, I'm either going to swing back or ignore you, and that's pretty much how all of humanity is going to respond. Like it or not, it is not the President's job to get 100% of the electorate approving of them, and ultimately in a night they can choose to spend four hours having a dick contest in a thread or they can spend four hours doing work that clearly isn't appreciated by that critic anyway. I consider it an absolute fact that the most constructive criticism comes from your own supporters, if they are genuinely wanting you to be the best. Many of my own Ministers over the past three terms have provided the best advice and the most candid evaluations of how things are going, and because they're actually, y'know, working towards the same goals and putting in the effort to make this a better place, I'm going to respect them a hell of a lot more than someone who starts on the offensive and doesn't even bother attempting to be reasonable. Swakistek said it very well in the above-linked thread:
If you want a more energetic and active political culture: make it one yourself, by presenting a credible alternative to what you are currently seeing. If you have no ideas yourself, or have not the ability to prosecute them, don't tear down those willing to put themselves on the line and call that progress. |
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| Cormac | May 20 2014, 11:52 AM Post #33 |
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Awesomesauce
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I essentially agree with those who have said drama is not the kind of activity we want here. I was, frankly, an ass here two years ago, and that didn't do anything to contribute to an improved political culture. I've also seen firsthand the effect that sustained, long-term confrontation and drama can have on a community during my past year and a bit in Osiris, and after that trench warfare I have no desire to see it again there, here, or elsewhere -- and I don't recommend it for anyone else. Innovation and enthusiasm are the keys to healthy activity. I agree that we lack those, to a degree, but the answer isn't a euphemistic "more active political culture" that in all likelihood means more confrontation and drama. That's a short burst of activity followed by an exodus of valuable contributors. In regard to the Senate, I agree with Skizzy that the problem is structural. In the short term, if we want to see more people running than there are seats, I would recommend that the Electoral Panel announce immediately when the next election is called that there will be more seats, delay the decision (or at least announcement of it) until the last minute, and then actually have more seats. That will encourage people who might not run to step up, because they'll have no idea how many seats will need filled. Introducing that level of uncertainty is a non-confrontational, mature way to add some interest. We don't need fights to make activity happen. Edited by Cormac, May 20 2014, 11:54 AM.
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Cormac Skollvaldr Vincit qui patitur (He conquers who endures) | |
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| PhDre | May 20 2014, 02:18 PM Post #34 |
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Rt. Hon. OG PhDre DMV AF1
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Where did I say we need to have fights to make Europeia stronger? Anumia, you say that you don't want to deal with people who say "this and this is not working" because they're not contribution to the thing that isn't working? Feel free to go off with all this rhetoric but when you say "If you want to be a serious competitor and present your own ideas and assert why your way is better, fine. Don't just seek to find fault and do nothing else" ... recognize that I wasn't saying "we need sideline people who are just here for the criticism. " I'm saying people who ARE involved are not critiquing because those in power don't deal with criticism very well, because our culture does not value critique. Any time Europeians mention "GAP has no updates in a long time and just 2(?) neighbors in 3 terms" the MoFC goes on a tirade about how it's not his style to give updates; any time we see Nazi regions raided, we don't want to admit to being wrong in being on the sideline on those raids. If you're going to ignore good advice or a good observation because it doesn't come from the right mouth, then I don't know if there's anything that can fix that. w/r/t to the election: my concern regarding the candidates might be indicative of my negativity. Or you know,I just don't think either platform is very forward-thinking. I think the electorate might be enthused because it's the first close election we'll have in a long time, but no one is talking about the wonderful ideas that candidate X or Y has. I voted immediately in the polls, but I'm not 'excited' about the election per se, maybe others are very excited.. |
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| Rach | May 20 2014, 03:18 PM Post #35 |
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At Least 5% Sugar
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As ever, PhDre is the sith lord
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♥ Love and Kindness are never wasted ♥ The 2011 President of the Year Queen of Balder Unofficial Navy Girl | |
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| modernsin | May 20 2014, 03:35 PM Post #36 |
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-_- Always a pleasure, Anumia. My constantly pointing out that I could, and did, get elected to Senate "for being lazy" (ie. not putting up a platform, basically being silent throughout the election, etc) was also not a sign of a well-balanced political culture. That was the point, as I had to spell out to people on Skype a couple times. It was an experiment on my part, and if I remember correctly, I carried away the second-highest number of votes in that election, despite being admittedly a pretty 'meh' legislator. I'd like to think that my pointing that out so much is part of the reason why Charlotte lost the next election to a newcomer (RZM) when she didn't put up a platform either. People started noticing how fucked up it was that you could get elected without putting in any effort, and Charlotte lost by a huge margin (sorry Charlotte ). And you think I don't accomplish things through criticism. I won't respond to subsequent points re: 'negative' political discourse/culture because I'd only be rehashing things I've said earlier in this thread. Suffice to say, there will always be 'negative' critics, and there will always be politicians who think that such criticism is unfair or the like (see recent comments in CSP's panel discussion thread). |
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| Elias Greyjoy | May 20 2014, 03:39 PM Post #37 |
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Lost in Space
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So what do we think will be the turnout for the next Senate election, taking into account that, one way or another, we will lose either one or two multi-consecutive term Senators and that the "summer slump" will be in full force? Or, alternatively, will we see a resurgence of candidates who are lackadaisical with their platforms and activity because if not them, then who? |
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Proprietor of The Europeia Times - The Premiere Independent News Source Named Best Journalist 2014 by the Euro Choice Awards Europeian CV/Awards and Honors WA Work Quotes I Like
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| PhDre | May 20 2014, 03:45 PM Post #38 |
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Rt. Hon. OG PhDre DMV AF1
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It would be interesting if we were somehow able to identify how many citizens vote, and if candidates end up with <X% support they do not get elected. If there aren't platforms and ideas circulating then I'm not going to vote for you this time around. |
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| hyanygo | May 20 2014, 04:06 PM Post #39 |
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There is like a constitutional change right now being discussed in the CA. Given that every Tom, Dick and Harry can comment on it and the only people to have been me, PhDre and modernsin .... Nothing for the Senate to do? What tripe. There is if you look hard enough (it just has got more difficult to do so). |
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| modernsin | May 20 2014, 04:20 PM Post #40 |
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As always, the safest bet is to look to the CA for ideal future candidates. Ogastein, Matthew Hopkins, Hy, and myself (and Dre, but I doubt he wants to give up his Chairmanship) have been relatively active within the CA as of late. Plus, after the Pres election, Anumia and Mal will be freed up for a Senate run if they so choose. I can't comment on how "lackadaisical" any of their platforms or activity will be, but they're all good legislators and good Europeians, so I'm disinclined to be pessimistic about the future Senate election. EDIT: TheStonedSurfers is another CA member who's been contributing recently. I haven't really talked with the guy, but he seems committed enough. We have plenty of promising candidates, it's just a matter of getting them to run during a fallow summer period. Edited by modernsin, May 20 2014, 04:25 PM.
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CV Accolades
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| Anumia | May 20 2014, 04:28 PM Post #41 |
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Anumia Novo Spiritus
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You will note that I saw your post announcing you will most likely run, as I responded to it within the same post. ![]()
I actually think the majority of the credit for that one goes elsewhere, but I'll acknowledge you contributed ![]()
So instead of working to fix the problem, you actively made it worse? |
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| modernsin | May 20 2014, 04:41 PM Post #42 |
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Not really. It's not like I stayed silent once I actually got (re)elected. In the past, I've usually only stood for Senate when there was a lack of other candidates in the mix. Believe it or not, I like when the Senate is active too! And once I get the job, I do what I can.In the same election in which Charlotte was defeated, I initially stood, intending to put up a platform and be more active and everything. But sudden RL constraints kept me from writing a platform in a timely fashion, so I withdrew. My 'silent campaign' the previous term was never intended to destabilize the election process or anything. And again, I think (hope) that my self-consciousness about it helped make people aware of the 'passive' voting and complacency that had been so common at the time. A negative strategy yielded positive results. That's all I was trying to point out. My future Senate runs certainly won't be 'silent' ones; that was a one-time deal.
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| Anumia | May 20 2014, 04:47 PM Post #43 |
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Anumia Novo Spiritus
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I look forward to that future, then. Be loud as a Senator; silent as a whiny critic, mebbe?
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| Elias Greyjoy | May 20 2014, 04:48 PM Post #44 |
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Lost in Space
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Sounds like a boring combination to me.
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Proprietor of The Europeia Times - The Premiere Independent News Source Named Best Journalist 2014 by the Euro Choice Awards Europeian CV/Awards and Honors WA Work Quotes I Like
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| modernsin | May 20 2014, 04:50 PM Post #45 |
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Yeah, keep dreaming, Anumia. Take comfort in the fact that I'll probably stop pestering you so much in a few days. Probably.
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). And you think I don't accomplish things through criticism. 













And once I get the job, I do what I can.
