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The Story Of The Little Red President; A story about resignation culture in Europeia
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Topic Started: Sep 27 2017, 01:26 AM (923 Views)
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Boomer
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Sep 27 2017, 06:06 PM
Post #31
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Casual and Unashamed
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I'm with XIV on this one. I resigned because of real-life issues that were causing me too much stress and anxiety to focus on the job. The issue blew over after a week or so, but I'm not yet ready to jump back into active Ministry work because of being extremely busy in real life, so is it a sin if I just want to be a more casual player for a bit?
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Boomer, EIN, ESS
  

Resume Senator (x5) Minister of World Assembly Affairs (x4) Hunger Games Host (x2) Flag of Month Host (former) Europeian Cup Host Master of Recruitment in Merridel
Miscellaneous Click this link please! Galturin MyMiniCityI have a SoundCloud channel! Check it out!Family Kaboom Bay Son of Prometheus Father of Pyntuma [insert last names here], Aditya Bay, and Comrade Snowball Napoleon Danger Bay-Saxton Grandfather of John Doe Bay-Saxton, DMZ Bay-Saxton and NauElect Bay-Saxton Great-uncle of Cokeland Chastain Brother of Rand Chastain and LeSageStupide Chastain
Netz's Dream-Crushing Protege Only the second Europeian in history to be awarded the Order of Influence without serving as Delegate Shiny things Quotes - Trinnien
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Rach making a valid point. CSP agreeing with her. Cubs win World Series. Trump wins Presidency. Cats and dogs living together. Mass hysteria.
At this point, all I can say is 2016 needs to lay off the drugs.
- Calvin Coolidge
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The people who look up at the stars and dream that one day they too can break incredibly helpful tools meant for the benefit of the region in a high energy burst of bravado.
- Ever-Wandering Souls
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Sometimes, Europeia raids. In other news, the pope is catholic, bears shit in the woods, and people don't like it when someone tries to start a righteous fury over something they've done for years.
- Lethen
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"Here, let's give the kid a shiny so we don't have to promote him"
- JayDee
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Now I'm really bad at math, but wasn't it supposed to be an hour later 2 hours ago?
- Notolecta
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we need them in time for eurotoday so I can talk about how much they suck
- Trinnien
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Seriously, there are days when I come in and do these post suppressions and I feel like a parent driving a car with the kids fighting in the back seat: "One more word from any of you and I'm turning this car around, and you're all grounded for the next month." Ugh, I've turned into my parents.
- Isaris
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Just when you thought you were safe, the turn 18 already jokes are back, Boom
- Drop Your Pants
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[For making the job of many defenders easier by being completely useless at raiding, I present you with this cookie medal.
- Constie
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The people in Europeia. That is what makes us great. Not our laws, not our population. Our people. Just everyday people putting out a helping hand. A true community. I wouldn't want to be apart of any other community, because I feel truly accepted here. In a chatroom with complete strangers is where I feel most at home. Funny how that works. You guys are like a second family to me and it's great. I don't wanna ever leave.
- Aexnidaral Seymour
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(in reference to a hypothetical Aex/Calvin ticket)
Europeia United: In Hating Us
- Drecq
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Yes. The UK is slowly sinking into the atlantic. It has been a matter of contention for months whether Mays government would choose to opt for a hard brexit or a soft brexit. May has instead opted for a wet brexit.
- Anonymous
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The ministry was dead. Two resignations in a row killed it. Kaboom came in and it sprang back to life. He's the Cat of the MoWA.
- Quote:
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Gleg - Today at 7:58 PM boomer which resignation Boom 🎸 - Today at 7:58 PM My last one From MoWA Gleg - Today at 7:58 PM ok just making sure kind of lost count there
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Rach
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Sep 27 2017, 06:14 PM
Post #32
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At Least 5% Sugar
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So which one is the horse, the pig and the rat? Personally I'd want to be the horse in HEMs story. Maybe it's the order they resigned in?
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♥ Love and Kindness are never wasted ♥ The 2011 President of the Year Queen of Balder Unofficial Navy Girl
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Aexnidaral Seymour
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Sep 27 2017, 06:26 PM
Post #33
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Somebody's got to keep you entertained.
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- Rach
- Sep 27 2017, 06:14 PM
So which one is the horse, the pig and the rat? Personally I'd want to be the horse in HEMs story. Maybe it's the order they resigned in? Can I call dibs on the rat? But only if it's the rat from Beast Wars.
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Family, Resume, and Awards Family  The Right Honourable Aexnidaral "Crist" Seymour Somerset

Son of North East Somerset and Rachel Husband of Pichtonia Seymour Somerset, Phantasus Chastain, and Ogastein Father of Isaris, Klatonia, XIV, and America Billiards Brother of JGlenn, Apollo, Brunhilde, and Ninja KittensResume and Awards "... Aex, who is treated like the Europeian version of Nickelback by a lot of people here."
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Skizzy Grey
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Sep 27 2017, 08:56 PM
Post #34
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insert random title here
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I get XIV's point. And I disagree with HEM to the extent he thinks we should criticize people for remaining active socially following a resignation.
But we have gone way too far in terms of letting people resign without consequences. We just elected a President who had resigned two different Cabinet posts in the preceding six months -- how did that work out? Or how about Boomer standing for Senate just seven days after he resigned his Senate seat? Of course RL comes first, and resignation is sometimes the best option, but we would do well to ask more questions when someone who steps away from a post abruptly seek to reassume major responsibilities within the region.
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Rach
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Sep 27 2017, 09:35 PM
Post #35
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At Least 5% Sugar
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Cats resignation as President had nothing to do with her previous resignations as you very well know.
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♥ Love and Kindness are never wasted ♥ The 2011 President of the Year Queen of Balder Unofficial Navy Girl
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Skizzy Grey
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Sep 27 2017, 09:56 PM
Post #36
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insert random title here
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- Rach
- Sep 27 2017, 09:35 PM
Cats resignation as President had nothing to do with her previous resignations as you very well know.
The point is that I don't recall any significant discussion about Cat's prior resignations. Certainly, we knew a lot less about them than we did about Brun's extended absence.
Would an examination of those prior resignations have caused us to question Cat's seriousness of purpose and dedication to the region? I don't know. But with the way our culture is, it would've seemed rude to pry into such matters. I'm suggesting that should change.
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Deepest House
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Sep 27 2017, 10:59 PM
Post #37
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When you're not concerned with succeeding, you can work with complete freedom.
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I've personally felt that "real life concerns" have been used as a crutch often when one is not up to the job. Clearly, I don't think it's the case all the time, but I'm positive that it is some of the time.
When people cite "real life issues" as their reason for resignations, it is often treated like the third rail and not touched, for better or worse.
We will likely never know when one is really affected by real life issues versus using it as a crutch. Habitual offenders are more likely to be guilty of it, but the truth is we will never really know.
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HEM:
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This thread is the best Europeian culture achievement in ten years.
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HEM
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Sep 27 2017, 11:29 PM
Post #38
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former substitute senator to aexnidaral seymour
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- XIV
- Sep 27 2017, 05:51 PM
- Skizzy Grey
- Sep 27 2017, 05:34 PM
- XIV
- Sep 27 2017, 04:44 PM
My resignations came from medical issues; namely my suicide attempt and the fact that I was facing a surgery I was told might take me up to a month to recover from (because the spine is a tricky area), and I know some recent resignations have come because people aren't feeling mentally up to the task of being a minister; or they've got their own health issues or sicknesses in their families that they've got to deal with, and some people have resigned because their coursework or their jobs are taking up too much time and they don't have the time they thought they did to contribute. It's unfair to chalk that up to 'not wanting to do the work' or 'not having pride in what they're doing'.
And in every case it's much easier to take three five minute periods a day and "pwn the spam zone", or to hang out in discord on your phone during your free time to chat with your friends; it doesn't mean that person is lazy because they're doing that instead of dedicating time they don't have, or which they can't dedicate, to massive projects in Europeia.
It's no surprise to me, because I've heard this on multiple occasions from newer members, that the legitimate reasons for resigning are also compounded by the fact that even 'okay' terms are often derided and looked down upon by Europeia; who would want to stay on in a position where they know they're not going to amazing and the end result is going to be people telling them that they should have resigned or been fired? Nobody. Now, on top of that, when they do resign we're telling them that they're lazy and don't want to do the work.
I doubt you were one of the folks HEM had in mind. You left for a time, then eased back into regional activity gradually. When someone runs for office or accepts an appointment soon after citing RL pressures as the reason for resigning from public office, it invites questions. Maybe the person just didn't want to do the first job. Alternatively, he/she may be too quick to make commitments that he/she cannot keep, such that we should expect the second engagement to end similarly to the first. Or maybe there are good reasons for resigning one position and accepting another soon after -- but we would never know, because some people pitch a fit when we discuss this issue even in general terms, let alone ask pointed questions to a nominee or candidate, so we let it slide. And the region suffers. And newer members are denied a chance to contribute, because when we have an unexamined problem with people not being sufficient committed, we instinctively default to on old hands whom we assume have proven their mettle -- even though some of them are really just deeply experienced at making commitments and not following through! Kudos to HEM for sparking a much-needed discussion.
I realize I'm not one of the people HEM had in mind when writing this post, the people HEM had in mind were Kaboom, Sam, and Siol; the fact that he didn't name them directly doesn't stop people from drawing the line to the three resignations that occurred this term. One of which occurred only hours before HEM was "inspired" to write this piece. The fact that I'm not being directly targeted by the Vice President's frustration and venom doesn't mean I can't sympathize with people who have chosen to put their personal lives before service to the republic; even, and especially, if they've chosen to stay active in the community following their resignations. I've said this to several people who've approached me in private about my reaction to this, but I would have had a much different reaction had this not been framed in the narrative of a condescending children's story laced with personal attacks and defended by the shoddy 'lol satire' tactic. If HEM had taken the time to write an actual article addressing the problem and trying to understand why people feel compelled to resign en masse almost every term, I would have applauded it. Heck, even if it had been framed as a speech calling for understanding for the fact that resignations hamper an administrations ability to complete all of the projects it aimed to complete, that would have been a step up from what this was. There seem to be a fair number of people here who actively wish to find ways to affix malicious intent to this article. That makes me sad, because I guess it means there are people here who are predisposed to dislike me and want to believe the worst? (This does not refer to objective criticism I have received, of course).
There is no direct line between this fictional satire and real people in the region. That's why the "Little Red Hen" parallel was a good vehicle for discussing the problem. There is no barn. There is no farm. The extent to which "real" Europeia was incorporated was in the most banal and generic ways imaginable (i.e. "eurochat" or "spam zone"). That was intentional.
I don't have the numbers on whether people are resigning more today than they were five years ago. I have sensed a definite uptick over the last half year, however, and I'm not the only one. That could indicate a number of things. There are plenty of valid points of view. Mine is that our region would probably be in a better place if some Ministers could hold the fort through some minor RL turbulence.
Am I right? Maybe not, I have no clue because we aren't allowed to talk about it. It seems that even those who breach the topic in the vaguest, most opaque terms are fair game to be labeled "venomous" and god knows only what is being said behind the scenes.
I'm not perfect. I don't have all the answers. But I think we should be able to talk about it, because no member will be able to enjoy the more casual sides of this region if nobody is left to serve the region.
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Boomer
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Sep 28 2017, 12:14 AM
Post #39
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Casual and Unashamed
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- Skizzy Grey
- Sep 27 2017, 08:56 PM
I get XIV's point. And I disagree with HEM to the extent he thinks we should criticize people for remaining active socially following a resignation.
But we have gone way too far in terms of letting people resign without consequences. We just elected a President who had resigned two different Cabinet posts in the preceding six months -- how did that work out? Or how about Boomer standing for Senate just seven days after he resigned his Senate seat? Of course RL comes first, and resignation is sometimes the best option, but we would do well to ask more questions when someone who steps away from a post abruptly seek to reassume major responsibilities within the region. I thought I was well enough to get back on the horse and run again, and also I will admit that I was somewhat pushed to run by the CRP. I dropped out because I realized that I was too busy to write a platform and because I didn't really want to be a Senator again after my bad term.
Edited by Boomer, Sep 28 2017, 12:14 AM.
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Boomer, EIN, ESS
  

Resume Senator (x5) Minister of World Assembly Affairs (x4) Hunger Games Host (x2) Flag of Month Host (former) Europeian Cup Host Master of Recruitment in Merridel
Miscellaneous Click this link please! Galturin MyMiniCityI have a SoundCloud channel! Check it out!Family Kaboom Bay Son of Prometheus Father of Pyntuma [insert last names here], Aditya Bay, and Comrade Snowball Napoleon Danger Bay-Saxton Grandfather of John Doe Bay-Saxton, DMZ Bay-Saxton and NauElect Bay-Saxton Great-uncle of Cokeland Chastain Brother of Rand Chastain and LeSageStupide Chastain
Netz's Dream-Crushing Protege Only the second Europeian in history to be awarded the Order of Influence without serving as Delegate Shiny things Quotes - Trinnien
-
Rach making a valid point. CSP agreeing with her. Cubs win World Series. Trump wins Presidency. Cats and dogs living together. Mass hysteria.
At this point, all I can say is 2016 needs to lay off the drugs.
- Calvin Coolidge
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The people who look up at the stars and dream that one day they too can break incredibly helpful tools meant for the benefit of the region in a high energy burst of bravado.
- Ever-Wandering Souls
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Sometimes, Europeia raids. In other news, the pope is catholic, bears shit in the woods, and people don't like it when someone tries to start a righteous fury over something they've done for years.
- Lethen
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"Here, let's give the kid a shiny so we don't have to promote him"
- JayDee
-
Now I'm really bad at math, but wasn't it supposed to be an hour later 2 hours ago?
- Notolecta
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we need them in time for eurotoday so I can talk about how much they suck
- Trinnien
-
Seriously, there are days when I come in and do these post suppressions and I feel like a parent driving a car with the kids fighting in the back seat: "One more word from any of you and I'm turning this car around, and you're all grounded for the next month." Ugh, I've turned into my parents.
- Isaris
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Just when you thought you were safe, the turn 18 already jokes are back, Boom
- Drop Your Pants
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[For making the job of many defenders easier by being completely useless at raiding, I present you with this cookie medal.
- Constie
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The people in Europeia. That is what makes us great. Not our laws, not our population. Our people. Just everyday people putting out a helping hand. A true community. I wouldn't want to be apart of any other community, because I feel truly accepted here. In a chatroom with complete strangers is where I feel most at home. Funny how that works. You guys are like a second family to me and it's great. I don't wanna ever leave.
- Aexnidaral Seymour
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(in reference to a hypothetical Aex/Calvin ticket)
Europeia United: In Hating Us
- Drecq
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Yes. The UK is slowly sinking into the atlantic. It has been a matter of contention for months whether Mays government would choose to opt for a hard brexit or a soft brexit. May has instead opted for a wet brexit.
- Anonymous
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The ministry was dead. Two resignations in a row killed it. Kaboom came in and it sprang back to life. He's the Cat of the MoWA.
- Quote:
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Gleg - Today at 7:58 PM boomer which resignation Boom 🎸 - Today at 7:58 PM My last one From MoWA Gleg - Today at 7:58 PM ok just making sure kind of lost count there
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Aexnidaral Seymour
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Sep 28 2017, 12:17 AM
Post #40
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Somebody's got to keep you entertained.
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- Deepest House
- Sep 27 2017, 10:59 PM
I've personally felt that "real life concerns" have been used as a crutch often when one is not up to the job. Clearly, I don't think it's the case all the time, but I'm positive that it is some of the time.
When people cite "real life issues" as their reason for resignations, it is often treated like the third rail and not touched, for better or worse.
We will likely never know when one is really affected by real life issues versus using it as a crutch. Habitual offenders are more likely to be guilty of it, but the truth is we will never really know. Ah, the internet version of "I'm resigning to spend time with my family."
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Family, Resume, and Awards Family  The Right Honourable Aexnidaral "Crist" Seymour Somerset

Son of North East Somerset and Rachel Husband of Pichtonia Seymour Somerset, Phantasus Chastain, and Ogastein Father of Isaris, Klatonia, XIV, and America Billiards Brother of JGlenn, Apollo, Brunhilde, and Ninja KittensResume and Awards "... Aex, who is treated like the Europeian version of Nickelback by a lot of people here."
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Drecq
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Sep 28 2017, 12:30 AM
Post #41
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EMPEROR OF THAT PLACE OVER THERE, RULER OF THINGS AND PEOPLES, BREEZEBORN, MOTHER OF LIZARDS
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- Aexnidaral Seymour
- Sep 28 2017, 12:17 AM
- Deepest House
- Sep 27 2017, 10:59 PM
I've personally felt that "real life concerns" have been used as a crutch often when one is not up to the job. Clearly, I don't think it's the case all the time, but I'm positive that it is some of the time.
When people cite "real life issues" as their reason for resignations, it is often treated like the third rail and not touched, for better or worse.
We will likely never know when one is really affected by real life issues versus using it as a crutch. Habitual offenders are more likely to be guilty of it, but the truth is we will never really know.
Ah, the internet version of "I'm resigning to spend time with my family."  Thats what I plan on being my stated reason when Im found in the (now defunct) Senate Offices coercing interns into providing me with sexual favors. You know, the old GOP classic.
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The Ven. Drecq ER ES ES ESH EEQ EED OR4 OR3 WE3


 Presidential Awards Order of Republica
 | Order of Senatia (Awarded twice)
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 | Order of Scholarship
 | Order of Edification
 | Order of Community Third and Fourth Class
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 | Order of Dedication
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Current Positions Vice Chancellor of Europeia Attorney General of Europeia Senate Clerk Captain of the Europeian Republican Navy -Reserve Member of the Europeian Bar Association Past Positions Speaker of the Europeian Senate Deputy Speaker of the Europeian Senate Senator of the Europeian Senate Chief Justice of the Europeian High Court Primus Inter Pares of the Europeian High Court Associate Justice of the Europeian High Court Vice President of Europeia Minister of the Interior Minister of Citizenship Integration Grand Admiral of the Europeian Republican Navy Deputy Minister of Foreign Cultivation Deputy Minister of Citizenship Integration
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Skizzy Grey
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Sep 28 2017, 02:33 AM
Post #42
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insert random title here
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- Deepest House
- Sep 27 2017, 10:59 PM
I've personally felt that "real life concerns" have been used as a crutch often when one is not up to the job. Clearly, I don't think it's the case all the time, but I'm positive that it is some of the time.
When people cite "real life issues" as their reason for resignations, it is often treated like the third rail and not touched, for better or worse.
We will likely never know when one is really affected by real life issues versus using it as a crutch. Habitual offenders are more likely to be guilty of it, but the truth is we will never really know. I think it's fine to give people a lot of space when they say they need to resign for personal reasons. When they step back into the fray, however, they should expect questions about why they stepped away, and why they don't expect to have to renege on their commitment again. This is what we have failed to do. As a consequence, we don't have a good sense of who is committed and who isn't, which in turn causes us to default to old hands when elections come around -- because hell, it feels like we can count on those folks (though truth be told, we've got old-timers with long track records of not following through).
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XIV
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Sep 28 2017, 02:47 AM
Post #43
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The Heropon
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- HEM
- Sep 27 2017, 11:29 PM
- XIV
- Sep 27 2017, 05:51 PM
- Skizzy Grey
- Sep 27 2017, 05:34 PM
- XIV
- Sep 27 2017, 04:44 PM
My resignations came from medical issues; namely my suicide attempt and the fact that I was facing a surgery I was told might take me up to a month to recover from (because the spine is a tricky area), and I know some recent resignations have come because people aren't feeling mentally up to the task of being a minister; or they've got their own health issues or sicknesses in their families that they've got to deal with, and some people have resigned because their coursework or their jobs are taking up too much time and they don't have the time they thought they did to contribute. It's unfair to chalk that up to 'not wanting to do the work' or 'not having pride in what they're doing'.
And in every case it's much easier to take three five minute periods a day and "pwn the spam zone", or to hang out in discord on your phone during your free time to chat with your friends; it doesn't mean that person is lazy because they're doing that instead of dedicating time they don't have, or which they can't dedicate, to massive projects in Europeia.
It's no surprise to me, because I've heard this on multiple occasions from newer members, that the legitimate reasons for resigning are also compounded by the fact that even 'okay' terms are often derided and looked down upon by Europeia; who would want to stay on in a position where they know they're not going to amazing and the end result is going to be people telling them that they should have resigned or been fired? Nobody. Now, on top of that, when they do resign we're telling them that they're lazy and don't want to do the work.
I doubt you were one of the folks HEM had in mind. You left for a time, then eased back into regional activity gradually. When someone runs for office or accepts an appointment soon after citing RL pressures as the reason for resigning from public office, it invites questions. Maybe the person just didn't want to do the first job. Alternatively, he/she may be too quick to make commitments that he/she cannot keep, such that we should expect the second engagement to end similarly to the first. Or maybe there are good reasons for resigning one position and accepting another soon after -- but we would never know, because some people pitch a fit when we discuss this issue even in general terms, let alone ask pointed questions to a nominee or candidate, so we let it slide. And the region suffers. And newer members are denied a chance to contribute, because when we have an unexamined problem with people not being sufficient committed, we instinctively default to on old hands whom we assume have proven their mettle -- even though some of them are really just deeply experienced at making commitments and not following through! Kudos to HEM for sparking a much-needed discussion.
I realize I'm not one of the people HEM had in mind when writing this post, the people HEM had in mind were Kaboom, Sam, and Siol; the fact that he didn't name them directly doesn't stop people from drawing the line to the three resignations that occurred this term. One of which occurred only hours before HEM was "inspired" to write this piece. The fact that I'm not being directly targeted by the Vice President's frustration and venom doesn't mean I can't sympathize with people who have chosen to put their personal lives before service to the republic; even, and especially, if they've chosen to stay active in the community following their resignations. I've said this to several people who've approached me in private about my reaction to this, but I would have had a much different reaction had this not been framed in the narrative of a condescending children's story laced with personal attacks and defended by the shoddy 'lol satire' tactic. If HEM had taken the time to write an actual article addressing the problem and trying to understand why people feel compelled to resign en masse almost every term, I would have applauded it. Heck, even if it had been framed as a speech calling for understanding for the fact that resignations hamper an administrations ability to complete all of the projects it aimed to complete, that would have been a step up from what this was.
There seem to be a fair number of people here who actively wish to find ways to affix malicious intent to this article. That makes me sad, because I guess it means there are people here who are predisposed to dislike me and want to believe the worst? (This does not refer to objective criticism I have received, of course). There is no direct line between this fictional satire and real people in the region. That's why the " Little Red Hen" parallel was a good vehicle for discussing the problem. There is no barn. There is no farm. The extent to which "real" Europeia was incorporated was in the most banal and generic ways imaginable (i.e. "eurochat" or "spam zone"). That was intentional. I don't have the numbers on whether people are resigning more today than they were five years ago. I have sensed a definite uptick over the last half year, however, and I'm not the only one. That could indicate a number of things. There are plenty of valid points of view. Mine is that our region would probably be in a better place if some Ministers could hold the fort through some minor RL turbulence. Am I right? Maybe not, I have no clue because we aren't allowed to talk about it. It seems that even those who breach the topic in the vaguest, most opaque terms are fair game to be labeled "venomous" and god knows only what is being said behind the scenes. I'm not perfect. I don't have all the answers. But I think we should be able to talk about it, because no member will be able to enjoy the more casual sides of this region if nobody is left to serve the region. Perhaps then you should actually try to talk about it, instead of writing overly cutesy "satire". A frank discussion, an actual article, would have been better than this.
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Deepest House
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Sep 28 2017, 02:56 AM
Post #44
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When you're not concerned with succeeding, you can work with complete freedom.
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Skizzy, you make an important distinction.
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This thread is the best Europeian culture achievement in ten years.
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Lethen
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Sep 28 2017, 04:07 AM
Post #45
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Remember when I was famous? Neither do I.
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- Group:
- Il Cancelliere Supremo
- Member
- #27
- Joined:
- April 9, 2007
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A lot of interesting points made, many of my thoughts already expressed by others in this thread. I pretty much entirely agree with Skizzy and HEM's underlying sentiments.
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me, basically (click)
A letter to a friend By the Prophetical Blessing of Nethel, Supreme Chancellor of the Republic of Europeia and the states within, Destined Overseer of His rightful yet forgotten realms of Estalcia and Old Europe and Crystal Falls, Defender of the Faith and New Jersey, and Heir to the concept of Sarcasm
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