| Welcome to Europeia! So what the heck is Europeia anyways? Can I join? So, I came here representing another region? I do not want to become a citizen. Where should I go? What offices are there for people to be elected into? What is there for me to do in Europeia? That answers most of my immediate questions. What if I have any more? |
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| Despite a Victory, ERN Receives Trenchant Remarks | ||
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| Topic Started: Sep 16 2017, 02:08 AM (532 Views) | ||
| Writinglegend | Sep 16 2017, 02:08 AM Post #1 | |
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Sleepy Gleg.
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![]() Despite a Victory, ERN Receives Trenchant Remarks By Writinglegend (Europeia – September 15, 2017) – Last major, the Europeian Republican Navy (ERN) completed a successful tag of 'Where Are the Other Nerds', a founderless region with one endorsement. In the victory announcement titled The ERNerds are Here, Grand Admiral Calvin Coolidge would note eight ERN Sailors attended the update. Eight updaters for an update operation is a remarkable feat that shows the display of update capabilities from our Independent military. Two Europeians used the victory announcement to lay down trenchant remarks regarding the usage of the ERN during the major update. "You had 8 people online for this raid and you hit one single region with a delegate that had just one endorsement," Senator Festvao jabbed in response to the victory announcement, ending off his comment with a sarcastic quip to hit home his point. "Okay then." Such a comment received a harsh response from former Grand Admiral Kylia Quilor, who let her exasperation of the situation show. "We know what you think of the ERN." Kylia is referencing a prior debate on the topic of military update activity that occurred during Senate confirmation hearings of former president Cat's cabinet nominations. In the thread within Discussion Forum on Senate Matters for the confirmation hearings, long time raider and Optio of The Roman Empire Vac lambasted the state of ERN update operations. "If you go into past raid reports from Euro none of the raids outside of the few large holds this region has led have not been meaningful targets [sic]." Vac was critical of Grand Admiral Calvin Coolidge's update operation philosophy due to the limited "tagging" during the updates. Kylia Quilor and Senator Skizzy Grey both then came to the defense of Grand Admiral Calvin Coolidge, arguing that tagging dozens of regions held little value for our republic. Senator Festavo would come to the defense of Vac in that previous discussion, arguing that such tagging would enable better training for our sailors. Due to these previous comments, it was no surprise that Vac jumped into the debate happening on the ERN victory announcement. "If I had 8 people show up for me in a night, we would be raiding all night," Vac stated, referencing his philosophy of "tagging dozens of regions" which he argued for during Cat's cabinet confirmation hearings. Communications Minister and ERN Active Duty participant JayDee jumped to the defense of the operation, noting that Europeia is not a raider region and asserting that Festavo and Vac were judging the ERN on inoperable metrics. This received push-back from Vac, who said, "I'm well aware Euro isn't a raider region," but would later add that, "Fest and I have our own opinions on how a military should operate." Vice Chancellor and former presidential candidate Brunhilde then interjected in the discussion, insisting that this operation did not show effectiveness or value as a military partner. "There's not much to be proud of when "showing our skill" consists of hitting a single target with a small number of endorsements by ourselves," she asserted. "I don't see how that shows our effectiveness or makes us a more attractive military partner." The EBC approached Senator Festavo for comment on the situation, in which we received a reply. "The ERN has been described by our President as the best in the game at taking regions," he stated, pushing his belief that the ERN has failed to live up to the promoted hype. "I want to see a more efficient ERN that hits better regions and more of them. I want an ERN that is truly the best in the game at taking regions." When the EBC approached Kylia Quilor for comment, she shunned the "false metric" that was being used by Festavo and Vac. "The ERN comes from a different school of thought re: raiding and we aren't concerned with some sort of 'who can hit the most regions in a night' contest." Calvin Coolidge would, too, provide a quote to our writer who approached him. "Watching the victory announcements is not the whole picture," he stated, providing brief information about the possibility that more targets were stacked. "While we aim for higher endorsement count targets when possible, it's not always practical." There is primed to be much discussion on the issue in the coming days and weeks ahead. Despite the comments, the ERN will continue to be a major force at the updates in representing the skill and ability of our sailors abroad. Time will tell if there is any alteration to the ERN's update operations. |
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| Vac | Sep 16 2017, 04:22 AM Post #2 | |
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The last paragraph is off the mark. In order to be a meaningful update force you have to be accomplishing something. And I'm afraid the ERN does little to actually showcase its skill.
Edited by Vac, Sep 16 2017, 04:23 AM.
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Vac mercer, ESSMinister of Communications![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Europeian CV quotes
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| Kylia Quilor | Sep 16 2017, 11:44 AM Post #3 | |
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Queen in My Own Mind
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The problem, Vac, is that you have the wrong definition of 'accomplish' something, tainted by your false metrics and obsession with raw numbers. | |
The Rt. Hon. Commodore Kylia Quilor, Dux Emeritus, Legatus, Quartius, Primus Pilus, Praefectus Vigilum Noctu, ERN![]() I. Am. Not. A. Nice. Person. Never underestimate the power of cynicism, pessimism and negativity to prevent terrible things from happening. Only idealists try to build the future on a mountain of bodies. Unfocused populism is just as dangerous, if not more so, to a Republic's survival as creeping authoritarianism. Tell people how you feel, honestly and frankly. If you like someone, tell them. If you don't like them, tell them - the world would be a better place if we all knew where we stood. Professional Credentials Testimonials To My Character
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| Deepest House | Sep 16 2017, 02:34 PM Post #4 | |
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When you're not concerned with succeeding, you can work with complete freedom.
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This is journalism. | |
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| Vac | Sep 16 2017, 02:44 PM Post #5 | |
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For you to suggest above all the gameplay regions, of all the talent. That you and your 4 hits per month are the pinnacle of achievement and the standard for success is quite arrogant and made me burn myself with coffee as I read it and laughed. |
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Vac mercer, ESSMinister of Communications![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Europeian CV quotes
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| XIV | Sep 16 2017, 05:13 PM Post #6 | |
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The Heropon
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Does TRE still preendorse before all their jumps? |
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| Kylia Quilor | Sep 16 2017, 05:19 PM Post #7 | |
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Queen in My Own Mind
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I didn't say that the ERN was the 'pinnacle of achievement'. |
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The Rt. Hon. Commodore Kylia Quilor, Dux Emeritus, Legatus, Quartius, Primus Pilus, Praefectus Vigilum Noctu, ERN![]() I. Am. Not. A. Nice. Person. Never underestimate the power of cynicism, pessimism and negativity to prevent terrible things from happening. Only idealists try to build the future on a mountain of bodies. Unfocused populism is just as dangerous, if not more so, to a Republic's survival as creeping authoritarianism. Tell people how you feel, honestly and frankly. If you like someone, tell them. If you don't like them, tell them - the world would be a better place if we all knew where we stood. Professional Credentials Testimonials To My Character
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| Festavo | Sep 16 2017, 09:57 PM Post #8 | |
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The Notorious
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Which metrics would you rather be used? Yes, we do. Pretty much every military does on most operations because it is more effective that way. Does the ERN not do this? Side note: This is not about TRE vs. ERN. This is about the ERN living up to the hype. You did not, but our President said that the ERN is the best in the game at taking regions which is simply inaccurate. |
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Minister of Communications in Europeia Former 2 Term Senator in Europeia Non-Europeian Resume Quotes [/center]
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| XIV | Sep 16 2017, 11:43 PM Post #9 | |
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The Heropon
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In some ways this is about TRE vs ERN, not in the 'oh em gee we h8 each othur 4evur' way, but in the manner of doing things. You want the ERN to emulate TREs methodology and metrics, I would rather give up raiding than do that. Every org draws it's own metric for success based on the methods it uses. Every organization, for the purposes of recruitment, uses a bit of hyperbole to increase its attractiveness to potential new members. It's counterproductive when people who don't understand this, and don't understand a particular organization's metrics, start actively criticizing an organization for not conforming to a wholly unrelated organizations metrics. The ERN does not preendorse, except in situations where we're required to do so due to cooperation with other regions. Should we preendorse? No, no we definitely should not. In the past I have likened raiding to riding a bicycle, and in that metaphor preendorsement is the equivalent training wheels. It keeps less skilled raiders from missing. For those who don't know, raiding with a preendorsement requires two skills: jumping and switching (moving regions and changing your WA nation), the method the ERN uses requires: jumping, endorsing, switching, and clean puppet maintenance among others. It's not hyperbole to say that our sailors are more skilled than most others out there, because most others out there don't have the same level of training or the same set of skills that the ERN sailors have, and hit or miss every operation we take part in the ERN develops those skills and improves the ability of its sailors. Switching and jumping are basic and easy. It doesn't require much in the way of finesse to do them. During Europeia's last collaboration with TRE I had time between every jump to resign the ERN, open my email in a new tab, join with my next puppet, close the extraneous tabs, endorse the point and still wait around for a little bit until the next go order, and I managed to be among the first nations into the region on each of the first jumps I took part in. |
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| Festavo | Sep 17 2017, 12:01 AM Post #10 | |
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1: I want the ERN to utilize the strengths that it has better. Right now by absolutely no metric or methodology is the ERN the best in the game at taking regions. We must either work towards and achieve that goal or we need to stop praising our military as something that it is not. 2: Pre-endorsing is a necessity unless either a) no defenders are online for the update or b) you outnumber them with enough endorsements to spare for any delegate endos you may be targeting. It also allows for better speed and precision (something I have heard that we should strive for actually). 3: It's fine if you have time to spare, but when defenders are out and outnumbe you then have to call the triggers as tight as you can. That does not allow room to endorse after the move and leaves more room for error and just takes more time overall. |
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| XIV | Sep 17 2017, 12:15 AM Post #11 | |
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The Heropon
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1. Best in the game is a phrase that has been used a few times over the past couple of days, but mostly it has been used by people arguing on your side of things, not on mine. The only notable example of it being used by people arguing my side was when it was used in a recruitment announcement (read the thing I said about about hyperbole and recruitment again here) by the president. Everyone exaggerates for recruitment purposes, everyone claims they're the best or most feared region in the game. You'll excuse me if I don't take anyone at face value. 2. Preendorsing is a necessity in the same way that using a script is a necessity. Namely in that it isn't a necessity at all. It makes things easier, and requires less skill, but you don't need to do it. 3. You win some you lose some, it's the name of the game. It's not necessary to preendorse in any situation, but that's a good excuse. Edited by XIV, Sep 17 2017, 12:17 AM.
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| Writinglegend | Sep 17 2017, 05:24 AM Post #12 | |
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Sleepy Gleg.
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| Skizzy Grey | Sep 17 2017, 11:48 AM Post #13 | |
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insert random title here
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In a significant military operation, the ERN would be seeking to seize a region with maximum stealth, opening a 12-hour window for reserves to pile in and hold the region. Our routine operations should be primarily focused on training for such a significant operation -- not on "tagging" as many regions as possible. Are there bonus points for snagging a harder target than the ERN did here? Sure, but that's a minor quibble. I'm far more interested in hearing how clean the jump was than I am with the choice of target in what was essentially a training operation. |
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| Brunhilde | Sep 17 2017, 06:42 PM Post #14 | |
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We shouldn't be implying that Fest wants Europeia to be like TRE. Fest has a different experience with military affairs than many Europieans gained from experience in multiple military forces and as a result, he holds different views as to what the ERN should be doing. That doesn't mean that he wants the ERN to operate like TRE and he has never suggested it does. That claim was leveled by another who was upset about the criticism. Dismissing his opinions with insults and accusations that he wants Europeia to be like TRE is disappointing. It ignores the subject and attacks the individual. We should be better than that. |
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| Snowball | Sep 17 2017, 07:45 PM Post #15 | |
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"That is essentially what tag raiding does in all honesty. It showcases speed and precision. Hitting 5 or 10 regions with 3 or 4 or 5 endorsements on the delegate is the way you should be approaching this in my honest opinion." Festavio has said this. Tag raiding is what TRE does |
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And I'm afraid the ERN does little to actually showcase its skill.







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